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3 Pages<123
Akirinyaga Secession from Agikuyu
radiomast
#41 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 7:42:54 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 2/15/2018
Posts: 272
Wakanyugi wrote:
radiomast wrote:
kaka2za wrote:


Really? Kikuyus managed to displace Maasais from most areas in present Central Province /Central Rift while Kisiis managed to break the Nilotic belt in Nyanza and South Rift.


Kisiis were already in Nyanza before Luos arrived. I am not sure what you mean by saying Kisiis broke the nilotic belt in South Rift.



Not quite. For more than 100 years, the Masai protected the hinterland of East Africa from Ottoman and Arabic slave raiders. The thing that did the Masai in were a) riderpest and b) the Masai themselves, through internecine civil war.


Maasai's protected the hinterland. But they did not occupy it. In fact Maasais's historically never stayed in one place. They were constantly on the move
Gathige
#42 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 8:07:55 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 3/29/2011
Posts: 2,074
Sansa wrote:
radiomast wrote:
When Agikuyu left Mt Kilimanjaro perhaps around 1300 AD , they left behind a small group who are now know as Sonjo. There are 30,000 of them. Their language bears similarities to Gikuyu language.

Listen



I don't know how you guys are hearing kikuyu here. It sounds closer to meru mixed with sound I hear from maasai.



aaaaauuuuuuiiiiii, aaaaaaauuuuuuuiiiiiiiiii, that sounds like nduru za wakikuyu. The Sonjo on the border btwn Kenya and TZ are referred to as Thonjo by their Kuyu brothers.
"Things that matter most must never be at the mercy of things that matter least." Goethe
limanika
#43 Posted : Monday, September 09, 2019 9:25:00 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 1,966
masukuma wrote:
Lolest! wrote:
kaka2za wrote:
hardwood wrote:
masukuma wrote:
interesting discussion... where did the Kikuyu originally come from? since the Kamba, Kikuyu, Meru, Embu and Akirinyaga once had a common heritage - what was the name of these people? the proto"Central" people.


From Congo, the kikuyu immigrated northwards from Mt Kilimanjaro/TZ area to the Mt kenya/aberdares area. The meru are said to have immigrated from the coast up the Tana river to Mt Kenya area and Nyambene hills.

Note that Kikuyus are the northernmost bantus in africa.



There are Bantus in Cameroon which seems to lie more to the North than Kenya.

Thought even Ugandan Bantus areas are generally more north than Kikuyu country

Leave alone across borders, aren't Bukusu lands notth of the equator?

The Meru, isn't their land north east of Kikuyu country?


There are Bantus in South Sudan and that is quite far north.

The Bantu practice mixed farming hence anywhere there's good climate conducive to farming you'll find them. If sahara was green you would find them there
Wakanyugi
#44 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2019 12:14:04 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 7/3/2007
Posts: 1,548
radiomast wrote:
Wakanyugi wrote:
radiomast wrote:
kaka2za wrote:


Really? Kikuyus managed to displace Maasais from most areas in present Central Province /Central Rift while Kisiis managed to break the Nilotic belt in Nyanza and South Rift.


Kisiis were already in Nyanza before Luos arrived. I am not sure what you mean by saying Kisiis broke the nilotic belt in South Rift.



Not quite. For more than 100 years, the Masai protected the hinterland of East Africa from Ottoman and Arabic slave raiders. The thing that did the Masai in were a) riderpest and b) the Masai themselves, through internecine civil war.


Maasai's protected the hinterland. But they did not occupy it. In fact Maasais's historically never stayed in one place. They were constantly on the move


That is true.

Nevertheless, their reputation as fearless fighters kept many intruders (including Bazungu explorers) from crossing Masailiand.

The Masai do 'occupy' the land, but their concept of ownership is very different from Bantu agriculturalists - basically summarized in that nomadic belief that: "the land (specifically anything that grows on the surface), belongs to the cow."

The fact that the Masai roam widely does not imply lack of ownership. After all they named every inch and would fight to protect grazing grounds from intruders, especially if there animals are threatened. Granted they will not bother to secure title, as a Kikuyu would, for instance, believing that the cow does it for them.
"The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
kaka2za
#45 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2019 12:58:02 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 10/3/2008
Posts: 3,544
Location: Gwitu
radiomast wrote:
kaka2za wrote:


Really? Kikuyus managed to displace Maasais from most areas in present Central Province /Central Rift while Kisiis managed to break the Nilotic belt in Nyanza and South Rift.


Kisiis were already in Nyanza before Luos arrived. I am not sure what you mean by saying Kisiis broke the nilotic belt in South Rift.


You are right. Kisiis occupied Kisumu between 1540 to 1790 and were pushed to present-day Kisii land by Luo migrating from Sudan and on the other side by constant raids by hostile nomadic pastoralist Nilotic communities of the Kipsigis, Nandi and Maasai
Sansa
#46 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2019 4:28:26 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 3/19/2013
Posts: 321
Gathige wrote:
Sansa wrote:
radiomast wrote:
When Agikuyu left Mt Kilimanjaro perhaps around 1300 AD , they left behind a small group who are now know as Sonjo. There are 30,000 of them. Their language bears similarities to Gikuyu language.

Listen



I don't know how you guys are hearing kikuyu here. It sounds closer to meru mixed with sound I hear from maasai.



aaaaauuuuuuiiiiii, aaaaaaauuuuuuuiiiiiiiiii, that sounds like nduru za wakikuyu. The Sonjo on the border btwn Kenya and TZ are referred to as Thonjo by their Kuyu brothers.


But that's it. There are very few other kikuyu sounding words. Maybe I need to give it another listen.
limanika
#47 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2019 5:57:46 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 1,966
kaka2za wrote:
radiomast wrote:
kaka2za wrote:


Really? Kikuyus managed to displace Maasais from most areas in present Central Province /Central Rift while Kisiis managed to break the Nilotic belt in Nyanza and South Rift.


Kisiis were already in Nyanza before Luos arrived. I am not sure what you mean by saying Kisiis broke the nilotic belt in South Rift.


You are right. Kisiis occupied Kisumu between 1540 to 1790 and were pushed to present-day Kisii land by Luo migrating from Sudan and on the other side by constant raids by hostile nomadic pastoralist Nilotic communities of the Kipsigis, Nandi and Maasai

I find it strange that the first well recorded wazungus - Vasco da gama and crews had already visited East coast by 1500AD yet even 300yrs later (say 1800AD) most of our people barely 400km in the interior never knew of white men existence
Lolest!
#48 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2019 6:45:04 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 11,693
Location: Kianjokoma
Quote:

I find it strange that the first well recorded wazungus - Vasco da gama and crews had already visited East coast by 1500AD yet even 300yrs later (say 1800AD) most of our people barely 400km in the interior never knew of white men existence


I think it's in Yuval Noah Harari's 'Sapiens' where the writer makes the argument that Europeans were able to conquer the rest of the world because of how our societies were closed.

He observes that the Spaniards conquered different tribes in the Americas using the same strategy. Had there been good information flows, the conquests would not have been as easy.
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
Wakanyugi
#49 Posted : Tuesday, September 10, 2019 9:10:00 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 7/3/2007
Posts: 1,548
limanika wrote:
kaka2za wrote:
radiomast wrote:
kaka2za wrote:


Really? Kikuyus managed to displace Maasais from most areas in present Central Province /Central Rift while Kisiis managed to break the Nilotic belt in Nyanza and South Rift.


Kisiis were already in Nyanza before Luos arrived. I am not sure what you mean by saying Kisiis broke the nilotic belt in South Rift.


You are right. Kisiis occupied Kisumu between 1540 to 1790 and were pushed to present-day Kisii land by Luo migrating from Sudan and on the other side by constant raids by hostile nomadic pastoralist Nilotic communities of the Kipsigis, Nandi and Maasai

I find it strange that the first well recorded wazungus - Vasco da gama and crews had already visited East coast by 1500AD yet even 300yrs later (say 1800AD) most of our people barely 400km in the interior never knew of white men existence


A Mr Thairu,one of the most interesting Kenyan anthropologists you have probably never heard of, says we should commemorate this protection by erecting two statues: one to the Maa warriors and the other to the mighty mosquitoes.



"The opposite of a correct statement is a false statement. But the opposite of a profound truth may well be another profound truth." (Niels Bohr)
limanika
#50 Posted : Wednesday, September 11, 2019 8:48:01 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 9/21/2011
Posts: 1,966
Wakanyugi wrote:
limanika wrote:
kaka2za wrote:
radiomast wrote:
kaka2za wrote:


Really? Kikuyus managed to displace Maasais from most areas in present Central Province /Central Rift while Kisiis managed to break the Nilotic belt in Nyanza and South Rift.


Kisiis were already in Nyanza before Luos arrived. I am not sure what you mean by saying Kisiis broke the nilotic belt in South Rift.


You are right. Kisiis occupied Kisumu between 1540 to 1790 and were pushed to present-day Kisii land by Luo migrating from Sudan and on the other side by constant raids by hostile nomadic pastoralist Nilotic communities of the Kipsigis, Nandi and Maasai

I find it strange that the first well recorded wazungus - Vasco da gama and crews had already visited East coast by 1500AD yet even 300yrs later (say 1800AD) most of our people barely 400km in the interior never knew of white men existence


A Mr Thairu,one of the most interesting Kenyan anthropologists you have probably never heard of, says we should commemorate this protection by erecting two statues: one to the Maa warriors and the other to the mighty mosquitoes.




Also in those days you couldn't lurk too far from the secure fortified villages coz of wild animals e.g. the man eaters of Tsavo. Language barriers and suspicions also meant communities in the hinterland couldn't have meaningful conversations with coastal communities beyond the barter trade. Lastly the life expectancy was very low hence some info that a singular elder could have passed to several generations was only shared with 1 or 2 generations hence either got distorted or lost altogether
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