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Low End Housing: High Risk, High Return
obiero
#321 Posted : Friday, June 14, 2019 1:52:42 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 12,791
Location: nairobi
jamplu wrote:
obiero wrote:
There's a little problem with the affordable housing push.. Will someone who bought a quarter piece of acre in Syokimau at KES 3m offer any sort of decent house at less than KES 7m https://www.businessdail...6564-ue2opuz/index.html



Unless mavoko changes their regulations in all zones within syokimau and allows you to do more than 4 units its just impossible to do anything less than 7M.

KCAA will also be on you if you go beyond 3rd floor in some areas of syokimau.


Affordable housing will actually only work towards Kangundo, Isinya, Loitokitok etc
COOP 5,500 ABP12.6; HF 30,000 ABP 5.90; KCB 7,500 ABP 36; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92
tinker
#322 Posted : Friday, June 14, 2019 2:11:55 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/15/2010
Posts: 412
Location: Nairobi
obiero wrote:
jamplu wrote:
obiero wrote:
There's a little problem with the affordable housing push.. Will someone who bought a quarter piece of acre in Syokimau at KES 3m offer any sort of decent house at less than KES 7m https://www.businessdail...6564-ue2opuz/index.html



Unless mavoko changes their regulations in all zones within syokimau and allows you to do more than 4 units its just impossible to do anything less than 7M.

KCAA will also be on you if you go beyond 3rd floor in some areas of syokimau.


Affordable housing will actually only work towards Kangundo, Isinya, Loitokitok etc


You can't write Kangundo and Loitokitok in same statement. it is 286 KM from Nairobi City.
....He who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion..
obiero
#323 Posted : Friday, June 14, 2019 6:22:55 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 12,791
Location: nairobi
tinker wrote:
obiero wrote:
jamplu wrote:
obiero wrote:
There's a little problem with the affordable housing push.. Will someone who bought a quarter piece of acre in Syokimau at KES 3m offer any sort of decent house at less than KES 7m https://www.businessdail...6564-ue2opuz/index.html



Unless mavoko changes their regulations in all zones within syokimau and allows you to do more than 4 units its just impossible to do anything less than 7M.

KCAA will also be on you if you go beyond 3rd floor in some areas of syokimau.


Affordable housing will actually only work towards Kangundo, Isinya, Loitokitok etc


You can't write Kangundo and Loitokitok in same statement. it is 286 KM from Nairobi City.

Hata huko kuna watu wanaishi bana
COOP 5,500 ABP12.6; HF 30,000 ABP 5.90; KCB 7,500 ABP 36; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92
Impunity
#324 Posted : Saturday, June 15, 2019 1:02:25 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2009
Posts: 26,267
Location: Masada
nairobby wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
hardwood wrote:
Selling a 25sqm single room at 3m is the biggest con ever since it translates to 120,000 Bob per sqm while cost of construction is 25k per m2. Ksh 3m can build you a 3bdrm house elsewhere. Also I thought all county approvals are for minimum 1bdr units, (like visionary kabogo recommended) lest we end up with high rise slums.


Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

You are crushing nairobby-wukan's dreams boss!
Karibu homes Mutongoni road Athi River ni kengine.
Those "homes" are 3m but if you stretch your arms you can literally touch opposite walls at once. This is why DC is the future. Wide open spaces and huge homes for a fraction of the cost per sqm and half of Nairobi is already there so amenities are fast catching up!


Those Kitengela homes going for 8/9m are fetching 35k rent. That's very poor. Looking at it from a rental play perspective these studios are a much better investment and have ready demand for them.


What do they mean by 45 years sublease?
Portfolio: Sold
You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.

obiero
#325 Posted : Saturday, June 15, 2019 5:16:57 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 12,791
Location: nairobi
Impunity wrote:
nairobby wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
hardwood wrote:
Selling a 25sqm single room at 3m is the biggest con ever since it translates to 120,000 Bob per sqm while cost of construction is 25k per m2. Ksh 3m can build you a 3bdrm house elsewhere. Also I thought all county approvals are for minimum 1bdr units, (like visionary kabogo recommended) lest we end up with high rise slums.


Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

You are crushing nairobby-wukan's dreams boss!
Karibu homes Mutongoni road Athi River ni kengine.
Those "homes" are 3m but if you stretch your arms you can literally touch opposite walls at once. This is why DC is the future. Wide open spaces and huge homes for a fraction of the cost per sqm and half of Nairobi is already there so amenities are fast catching up!


Those Kitengela homes going for 8/9m are fetching 35k rent. That's very poor. Looking at it from a rental play perspective these studios are a much better investment and have ready demand for them.


What do they mean by 45 years sublease?

Could it be that they are leasing from a lessor
COOP 5,500 ABP12.6; HF 30,000 ABP 5.90; KCB 7,500 ABP 36; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92
Impunity
#326 Posted : Sunday, June 16, 2019 7:10:37 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/2/2009
Posts: 26,267
Location: Masada
obiero wrote:
Impunity wrote:
nairobby wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
hardwood wrote:
Selling a 25sqm single room at 3m is the biggest con ever since it translates to 120,000 Bob per sqm while cost of construction is 25k per m2. Ksh 3m can build you a 3bdrm house elsewhere. Also I thought all county approvals are for minimum 1bdr units, (like visionary kabogo recommended) lest we end up with high rise slums.


Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

You are crushing nairobby-wukan's dreams boss!
Karibu homes Mutongoni road Athi River ni kengine.
Those "homes" are 3m but if you stretch your arms you can literally touch opposite walls at once. This is why DC is the future. Wide open spaces and huge homes for a fraction of the cost per sqm and half of Nairobi is already there so amenities are fast catching up!


Those Kitengela homes going for 8/9m are fetching 35k rent. That's very poor. Looking at it from a rental play perspective these studios are a much better investment and have ready demand for them.


What do they mean by 45 years sublease?

Could it be that they are leasing from a lessor


After 45 years what happens to my kids?
Portfolio: Sold
You know you've made it when you get a parking space for your yatcht.

hardwood
#327 Posted : Sunday, June 16, 2019 10:36:17 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,553
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
Impunity wrote:
obiero wrote:
Impunity wrote:
nairobby wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
hardwood wrote:
Selling a 25sqm single room at 3m is the biggest con ever since it translates to 120,000 Bob per sqm while cost of construction is 25k per m2. Ksh 3m can build you a 3bdrm house elsewhere. Also I thought all county approvals are for minimum 1bdr units, (like visionary kabogo recommended) lest we end up with high rise slums.


Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

You are crushing nairobby-wukan's dreams boss!
Karibu homes Mutongoni road Athi River ni kengine.
Those "homes" are 3m but if you stretch your arms you can literally touch opposite walls at once. This is why DC is the future. Wide open spaces and huge homes for a fraction of the cost per sqm and half of Nairobi is already there so amenities are fast catching up!


Those Kitengela homes going for 8/9m are fetching 35k rent. That's very poor. Looking at it from a rental play perspective these studios are a much better investment and have ready demand for them.


What do they mean by 45 years sublease?

Could it be that they are leasing from a lessor


After 45 years what happens to my kids?


Your kids will be kicked out after the sublease ends and the flat sold to someone else.
obiero
#328 Posted : Sunday, June 16, 2019 3:29:58 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 12,791
Location: nairobi
hardwood wrote:
Impunity wrote:
obiero wrote:
Impunity wrote:
nairobby wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
hardwood wrote:
Selling a 25sqm single room at 3m is the biggest con ever since it translates to 120,000 Bob per sqm while cost of construction is 25k per m2. Ksh 3m can build you a 3bdrm house elsewhere. Also I thought all county approvals are for minimum 1bdr units, (like visionary kabogo recommended) lest we end up with high rise slums.


Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

You are crushing nairobby-wukan's dreams boss!
Karibu homes Mutongoni road Athi River ni kengine.
Those "homes" are 3m but if you stretch your arms you can literally touch opposite walls at once. This is why DC is the future. Wide open spaces and huge homes for a fraction of the cost per sqm and half of Nairobi is already there so amenities are fast catching up!


Those Kitengela homes going for 8/9m are fetching 35k rent. That's very poor. Looking at it from a rental play perspective these studios are a much better investment and have ready demand for them.


What do they mean by 45 years sublease?

Could it be that they are leasing from a lessor


After 45 years what happens to my kids?


Your kids will be kicked out after the sublease ends and the flat sold to someone else.

But in law, the current occupant will be given first priority to place a bid
COOP 5,500 ABP12.6; HF 30,000 ABP 5.90; KCB 7,500 ABP 36; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92
obiero
#329 Posted : Sunday, June 16, 2019 3:31:38 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 12,791
Location: nairobi
hardwood wrote:
Impunity wrote:
obiero wrote:
Impunity wrote:
nairobby wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
hardwood wrote:
Selling a 25sqm single room at 3m is the biggest con ever since it translates to 120,000 Bob per sqm while cost of construction is 25k per m2. Ksh 3m can build you a 3bdrm house elsewhere. Also I thought all county approvals are for minimum 1bdr units, (like visionary kabogo recommended) lest we end up with high rise slums.


Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly Laughing out loudly

You are crushing nairobby-wukan's dreams boss!
Karibu homes Mutongoni road Athi River ni kengine.
Those "homes" are 3m but if you stretch your arms you can literally touch opposite walls at once. This is why DC is the future. Wide open spaces and huge homes for a fraction of the cost per sqm and half of Nairobi is already there so amenities are fast catching up!


Those Kitengela homes going for 8/9m are fetching 35k rent. That's very poor. Looking at it from a rental play perspective these studios are a much better investment and have ready demand for them.


What do they mean by 45 years sublease?

Could it be that they are leasing from a lessor


After 45 years what happens to my kids?


Your kids will be kicked out after the sublease ends and the flat sold to someone else.

But in law, the current occupant will be given first priority to place a bid
COOP 5,500 ABP12.6; HF 30,000 ABP 5.90; KCB 7,500 ABP 36; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92
obiero
#330 Posted : Saturday, July 25, 2020 6:25:43 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 12,791
Location: nairobi
Interesting https://www.businessdail...98138-wxlqlcz/index.html
COOP 5,500 ABP12.6; HF 30,000 ABP 5.90; KCB 7,500 ABP 36; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92
Ericsson
#331 Posted : Saturday, July 25, 2020 6:28:28 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 8,699
Location: NAIROBI
[quote=obiero]Interesting https://www.businessdail...8138-wxlqlcz/index.html[/quote]

It's the state of the economy.
It's getting tough by the day.
tony stark
#332 Posted : Thursday, August 06, 2020 12:10:45 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 7/8/2008
Posts: 881
[quote=obiero]Interesting https://www.businessdail...8138-wxlqlcz/index.html[/quote]


So Obiero are your stocks performing as well as your property??

Has the Rona changed your investment principles!!
obiero
#333 Posted : Saturday, August 08, 2020 7:43:21 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 12,791
Location: nairobi
tony stark wrote:
[quote=obiero]Interesting https://www.businessdail...8138-wxlqlcz/index.html[/quote]


So Obiero are your stocks performing as well as your property??

Has the Rona changed your investment principles!!

My principle remains 5% stocks, 95% real estate.. There's a dip in property values but I am not a seller! Actually buying one more unit in Nairobi
COOP 5,500 ABP12.6; HF 30,000 ABP 5.90; KCB 7,500 ABP 36; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92
amorphous
#334 Posted : Monday, August 10, 2020 8:30:08 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 5/15/2019
Posts: 363
Location: planet earth


Low end housing ndiyo hiyo sasa. Pipu, Nai. This is how ALL of Nai will look like in 30 years time. Kile and Lavi inclusive Laughing out loudly I passed the AHP on Park road and just SMH in amazement. Looks shiny, but check back in ten years. It will be a disaster. Too many people in too many tiny spaces in one building. That's why we keep saying DC is the future. In Jewel in the Crown, for example, the defining line is "the bridge." Once you cross it you are in middle class suburbs that are controlled and will never turn to urban slums in the next 50 years why?

1) Most people love being "close to Nairobi" because they think the universe revolves around Nairobi CBD. Hustlers pia always walk towards town searching for jobs, not away from it, so these suburbs of DC will never experience demand for pipu style high rise flats. Instead, as has been happening the past twenty years, the middle classes will flood OUT of Nai core into DC burbs; for space, comfort and peace of mind.

2) One needs a reliable car to commute to and from these burbs meaning they are doomed to remaining for the middle and upper classes.

3) As opposed to places like Lavi where nyumbas were moja moja and not in gated communities, the gated communities concept keeps expanding (due to security concerns) which means the model will keep multiplying in DC well into the foreseeable future. The large tracts of open land make this possible. Once a community is gated it is EXTREMELY DIFFICULT to turn it into anything else as there will always be dissenting voices who will shoot down the idea of introducing flats, for example into the gated community; since it has its rules and even elections of officials on a yearly basis. This is a beautiful ting oo!

4) The types of beautiful homes (mansions) coming up will not allow for future redevelopment even in 100 years. Think Runda and Muthaiga vs Kileleshwa. Runda and Muthaiga homes, for the most part are mansion bin mansions. A lot of effort thought, good memories of occupants and investment as gone into them. Tearing such down to build apartments is not sensible. In Kileleshwa they had tu-old ooooold tiny beberu colonial bungalows that have long been overtaken by time. It was inevitable that they would all be torn own for highrises to come up.

NIMESEMA!
Emotions and ego are twin enemies of strategy
sqft
#335 Posted : Monday, August 10, 2020 9:41:30 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/10/2015
Posts: 635
Location: Kenya
amorphous wrote:


3) As opposed to places like Lavi where nyumbas were moja moja and not in gated communities, the gated communities concept keeps expanding (due to security concerns) which means the model will keep multiplying in DC well into the foreseeable future. The large tracts of open land make this possible. Once a community is gated it is EXTREMELY DIFFICULT to turn it into anything else as there will always be dissenting voices who will shoot down the idea of introducing flats, for example into the gated community; since it has its rules and even elections of officials on a yearly basis. This is a beautiful ting oo!

NIMESEMA!


This is what is saving many people huko suburbs. Before anyone builds they must submit architectural plans to the gated estate committee for approval, and its only then that they can submit the plans to county authorities. Without this kind of strong self regulation, some mad man will want to put a high rise flat next to your home.

There are some cases where some individuals try to deceive the estate committee by submitting a different plan from what they intend to build but estate management do closely monitor the buildings for any deviation from the approved plans. I know a guy who was hospitalized due to shock (he nearly died) after he went to his building site one morning and found that his structure had been brought down at night by his neighbors/estate committee due to not following the submitted building plans. He had defied the committee saying the plot was his and could do whatever he wanted ,and had spent the previous day koroga-ring the first floor slab but the angry neighbours brought down the whole structure in the evening. He had to sell his plot and move away coz he could no longer live in such a "hostile environment". That is how his millions in construction costs went down the drain.

The suburbs we admire in western countries are the result of the strict adherence to the building/planning codes and regulations. The county authorities there are very thorough in enforcing those regulations. Here in kenya the authorities are sometimes compromised and that is why wananchi have to take the law into their hands to enforce the building codes.
Exodus 20:17 Thou shall not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shall not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ass, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's.
amorphous
#336 Posted : Monday, August 10, 2020 10:41:18 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 5/15/2019
Posts: 363
Location: planet earth
sqft wrote:
amorphous wrote:


3) As opposed to places like Lavi where nyumbas were moja moja and not in gated communities, the gated communities concept keeps expanding (due to security concerns) which means the model will keep multiplying in DC well into the foreseeable future. The large tracts of open land make this possible. Once a community is gated it is EXTREMELY DIFFICULT to turn it into anything else as there will always be dissenting voices who will shoot down the idea of introducing flats, for example into the gated community; since it has its rules and even elections of officials on a yearly basis. This is a beautiful ting oo!

NIMESEMA!


This is what is saving many people huko suburbs. Before anyone builds they must submit architectural plans to the gated estate committee for approval, and its only then that they can submit the plans to county authorities. Without this kind of strong self regulation, some mad man will want to put a high rise flat next to your home.

There are some cases where some individuals try to deceive the estate committee by submitting a different plan from what they intend to build but estate management do closely monitor the buildings for any deviation from the approved plans. I know a guy who was hospitalized due to shock (he nearly died) after he went to his building site one morning and found that his structure had been brought down at night by his neighbors/estate committee due to not following the submitted building plans. He had defied the committee saying the plot was his and could do whatever he wanted ,and had spent the previous day koroga-ring the first floor slab but the angry neighbours brought down the whole structure in the evening. He had to sell his plot and move away coz he could no longer live in such a "hostile environment". That is how his millions in construction costs went down the drain.

The suburbs we admire in western countries are the result of the strict adherence to the building/planning codes and regulations. The county authorities there are very thorough in enforcing those regulations. Here in kenya the authorities are sometimes compromised and that is why wananchi have to take the law into their hands to enforce the building codes.


Exactly! Imagine those who choose to buy in a cramped urban skyrise like this new one in Kilimanid'oh! . A family consisting of dad, mum, 3 kids who will NEVER know what it feels like to ride a bike in the open winds! Then squeezing with strangers in the lift kila siku. And trying to suffer to slide your car in the tiny basement parking. Is that life? Give me my lawns and space and comfort and joy in DC over this a million times over any day!


Emotions and ego are twin enemies of strategy
obiero
#337 Posted : Monday, August 10, 2020 11:51:03 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 12,791
Location: nairobi
amorphous wrote:
sqft wrote:
amorphous wrote:


3) As opposed to places like Lavi where nyumbas were moja moja and not in gated communities, the gated communities concept keeps expanding (due to security concerns) which means the model will keep multiplying in DC well into the foreseeable future. The large tracts of open land make this possible. Once a community is gated it is EXTREMELY DIFFICULT to turn it into anything else as there will always be dissenting voices who will shoot down the idea of introducing flats, for example into the gated community; since it has its rules and even elections of officials on a yearly basis. This is a beautiful ting oo!

NIMESEMA!


This is what is saving many people huko suburbs. Before anyone builds they must submit architectural plans to the gated estate committee for approval, and its only then that they can submit the plans to county authorities. Without this kind of strong self regulation, some mad man will want to put a high rise flat next to your home.

There are some cases where some individuals try to deceive the estate committee by submitting a different plan from what they intend to build but estate management do closely monitor the buildings for any deviation from the approved plans. I know a guy who was hospitalized due to shock (he nearly died) after he went to his building site one morning and found that his structure had been brought down at night by his neighbors/estate committee due to not following the submitted building plans. He had defied the committee saying the plot was his and could do whatever he wanted ,and had spent the previous day koroga-ring the first floor slab but the angry neighbours brought down the whole structure in the evening. He had to sell his plot and move away coz he could no longer live in such a "hostile environment". That is how his millions in construction costs went down the drain.

The suburbs we admire in western countries are the result of the strict adherence to the building/planning codes and regulations. The county authorities there are very thorough in enforcing those regulations. Here in kenya the authorities are sometimes compromised and that is why wananchi have to take the law into their hands to enforce the building codes.


Exactly! Imagine those who choose to buy in a cramped urban skyrise like this new one in Kilimanid'oh! . A family consisting of dad, mum, 3 kids who will NEVER know what it feels like to ride a bike in the open winds! Then squeezing with strangers in the lift kila siku. And trying to suffer to slide your car in the tiny basement parking. Is that life? Give me my lawns and space and comfort and joy in DC over this a million times over any day!



True. The standard of living will be compromised somewhat but the fact remains that vertical houses create affordability
COOP 5,500 ABP12.6; HF 30,000 ABP 5.90; KCB 7,500 ABP 36; KQ 414,100 ABP 7.92
VituVingiSana
#338 Posted : Monday, August 10, 2020 12:29:19 PM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 17,163
Location: Nairobi
World's tallest prefab skyscrapers will rise in Singapore
https://www.cnn.com/styl...al&utm_source=twCNN
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
heri
#339 Posted : Monday, August 10, 2020 1:01:20 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 9/14/2011
Posts: 767
Location: nairobi
obiero wrote:
tony stark wrote:
[quote=obiero]Interesting https://www.businessdail...8138-wxlqlcz/index.html[/quote]


So Obiero are your stocks performing as well as your property??

Has the Rona changed your investment principles!!

My principle remains 5% stocks, 95% real estate.. There's a dip in property values but I am not a seller! Actually buying one more unit in Nairobi


What rough estimated % do you think the dip in prices is? Is it very different between residential and commercial
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