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Graduate Salaries in Kenya : A Review
new investor
#1 Posted : Thursday, October 27, 2011 8:59:14 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/26/2007
Posts: 118
Dear Wazuans,

As a graduate who keeps getting very low salary offers from companies who have indicated specifically the want a graduate, I have decided to create a website to NAME and SHAME all those companies who are paying graduates less than Kes 50,000 gross salary.

I will make an open forum where one sends a scanned payslip, we verify and publish (Withholding the name, of course)

I believe this forum will make Kenyans realise how companies are exploiting both ways, (Charging high prices for their products/ services and paying very low salaries)

Keeping in mind that most of these graduates have to pay rent, transport and HELB loans, you are left wondering how they can even feed themselves leave alone spouses or children.

I need input from you fellow wazuans on how this might work. Thanks for your contribution.
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Lolest!
#2 Posted : Thursday, October 27, 2011 9:15:30 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 3/18/2011
Posts: 11,380
Location: Kianjokoma
This will get you into trouble with some wazuans. 50K? How many firms can afford to pay that much for their entire population of graduate staff? We have an employers market: supply outstrips demand
Laughing out loudly smile Applause d'oh! Sad Drool Liar Shame on you Pray
Rollout
#3 Posted : Thursday, October 27, 2011 10:27:31 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/26/2011
Posts: 691
@ new investor,

It is Oligopsony market so you can waste your enegry posting it but at the end of the day, who call the shots?
jerry
#4 Posted : Thursday, October 27, 2011 10:40:45 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/29/2006
Posts: 2,570
@lowest! Demand outstrips supply?
The opposite of courage is not cowardice, it's conformity.
jasonhill
#5 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 5:41:45 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/22/2011
Posts: 322
Location: Chicago, IL, USA
I recall that several times on this board, and when speaking to people when conducting my own research, that there is a myth that the reason that business process outsourcing will "never work" in Kenya is because "salaries are too high; higher than India", which I always thought to be pure nonsense, because salaries for BPO in India are about a third to a half what they are in the US... and US companies are paying a LOT more than 50,000 KES a month per head. More like 250,000 KES per month.

At these wages, BPO to Kenya will most certainly work. The business case is strong.

Best,

Hill
alma
#6 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 7:22:35 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/20/2007
Posts: 4,432
Instead of graduates always complaining about earning less than 50k, why don't they go create those jobs instead?

Ati name and shame a company which has found a graduate who's willing to work!

Someone needs to go to these colleges and explain to them the intricacies of supply and demand economics. If I have 10 graduates of equal value and one asks for 10k and another 50k, I must go with the lower cost, all things being equal. A wage bill is a cost.

I say cost, because most graduates have no value. They want to get a job! Not create value in any organisation. If you can prove value, then someone will pay you well. If you prove cost, then you get paid cost.

As for BPO's not working in Kenya...I think we read too many newspapers from journalist who all at wazua have agreed are too shady.
Jose: If I make it through this thug life, I'll see you one day. The Lord is the only way to stop the hurt.
2012
#7 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 7:40:32 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,222
Location: Nairobi
I think @ new investor has a point. Kenya has great brains and hard working people so I think it is wrong to exploit this resource the way it's being done while we sit back and cry about capital flight and exporting labour. We don't have enough doctor's, nurses, engineers etc. Why do we allow multi-nationals to come and exploit this great resource we possess? I especially applaud the Govt. as the largest employer for increasing wages of qualified civil servants and now they are giving private businesses a run for their money and shaming them at the same time.
Go ahead and start the website although I doubt anyone will send you their pay slip because it's very easy for a co. to trace it back to the owner.

One thing is clear about Kenya, taxes are for enriching thieves.
Gordon Gekko
#8 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 9:24:24 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 5/27/2008
Posts: 3,760
In my small sphere of work, I get better value from technicians out of polytechnics, better accounts staff from CPA graduates. I have been hugely disappointed by the so called graduates seconded to me.
Gordon Gekko
#9 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 9:26:54 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 5/27/2008
Posts: 3,760
In my small sphere of work, I get better value from technicians out of polytechnics, better accounts staff from CPA graduates. I have been hugely disappointed by the so called graduates seconded to me.
2012
#10 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 9:28:51 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,222
Location: Nairobi
Gordon Gekko wrote:
In my small sphere of work, I get better value from technicians out of polytechnics, better accounts staff from CPA graduates. I have been hugely disappointed by the so called graduates seconded to me.


That's very true! It's because our national universities teach 1970 theories while poly teaches practical and application and I think that's why most university graduates are employees.

One thing is clear about Kenya, taxes are for enriching thieves.
Kaykay
#11 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 9:40:56 AM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 7/14/2011
Posts: 27
Location: Mombasa
@alma, offer the 10k then see if he will be around for long. Soon you will find yourself back to the first step or recruiting and in the end spend more on recruitment in terms of money and time that it wont be worth it. Yes they dont have value but you are forgetting that once trained they are something else. A good employer is one who looks after the employee, pay him enough to be able to live comfortably such as afford to rent in a good place, dress well etc because at the end of the day they carry the name of the company.
@2012, these guys in fact exploit the internship system. They get cheap labour and are ever taking interns not to teach them but as an extra pair of hands to work.
Kaykay
#12 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 9:48:39 AM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 7/14/2011
Posts: 27
Location: Mombasa
2012 wrote:
Gordon Gekko wrote:
In my small sphere of work, I get better value from technicians out of polytechnics, better accounts staff from CPA graduates. I have been hugely disappointed by the so called graduates seconded to me.


That's very true! It's because our national universities teach 1970 theories while poly teaches practical and application and I think that's why most university graduates are employees.


Why not invest in good recruitment practices?
accelriskconsult
#13 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 10:09:59 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/2/2011
Posts: 629
Location: Nai
Gordon Gekko wrote:
In my small sphere of work, I get better value from technicians out of polytechnics, better accounts staff from CPA graduates. I have been hugely disappointed by the so called graduates seconded to me.



I think there is a confusion about what to expect from University graduates.

There is such a thing as pure book keeping for which you require a technician (KATC) rather than a professional (CPA) or a draftsman rather than an architect. A B.com accounting graduate can only be referred to as an accountant after passing a professional accounting exam and practising for not less than 2 years.

Once you move away from book keeping and start considering financial management or management accounting, try the technician and you get into trouble instantly. At the grad/CPA/ACCA/CFA level, you have to understand that you are training someone to become a manager/key decision maker in 3 - 5 yrs. If your CPA candidate started at KATC level because (s)he did not qualify to directly sit the CPA exam, chances are that all you can train them to become is junior level management- can never see the big picture and is always caught in the nitty gritty of every day life.

I think we all need to (i)define what we expect from graduates (ii) improve recruitment practices - most of the time this is where Company's, recruiters fail (iii) Be willing to train and not expect instant solutions - this is called investing

The kind of graduate we end up with says a lot about who we are as recruiters. May be, we should start by looking at ourselves and laying the blame squarely at our door steps.

danas10
#14 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 10:15:28 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 10/8/2010
Posts: 763
Location: Intersection
There are organisations where some employees are paid more than others despite all doing the same job. You have to prove your value on the job and if the organisation realises they could lose you to competition, and you are very valuable, they will up your salary. While its true there are some employees who are just happy to report to work and later go home.
sky5
#15 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 10:28:09 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 5/7/2010
Posts: 282
Location: Nairobi
The business world does not pay for knowledge or academic papers. But it pays for what a person does with what he knows - That is productivity.

If an employee can prove good productivity, s/he will certainly get a raise and praise.
incognito
#16 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 10:44:07 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 6/29/2011
Posts: 233
accelriskconsult wrote:
Gordon Gekko wrote:
In my small sphere of work, I get better value from technicians out of polytechnics, better accounts staff from CPA graduates. I have been hugely disappointed by the so called graduates seconded to me.



I think there is a confusion about what to expect from University graduates.

There is such a thing as pure book keeping for which you require a technician (KATC) rather than a professional (CPA) or a draftsman rather than an architect. A B.com accounting graduate can only be referred to as an accountant after passing a professional accounting exam and practising for not less than 2 years.

Once you move away from book keeping and start considering financial management or management accounting, try the technician and you get into trouble instantly. At the grad/CPA/ACCA/CFA level, you have to understand that you are training someone to become a manager/key decision maker in 3 - 5 yrs. If your CPA candidate started at KATC level because (s)he did not qualify to directly sit the CPA exam, chances are that all you can train them to become is junior level management- can never see the big picture and is always caught in the nitty gritty of every day life.

I think we all need to (i)define what we expect from graduates (ii) improve recruitment practices - most of the time this is where Company's, recruiters fail (iii) Be willing to train and not expect instant solutions - this is called investing

The kind of graduate we end up with says a lot about who we are as recruiters. May be, we should start by looking at ourselves and laying the blame squarely at our door steps.



True. Same case when it comes to hiring a technician and an engineer. Most companies get confused when hiring the two. When you give a graduate engineer a technician's Job Description he is bound to fail. Why? To put it in simply. A technician is more of a hands-on maintenance guy, who interprets the instructions in a manual and replaces a machine part that needs to be replaced. An engineer is the guy that designs the machine and writes the manual. He may not build the machine by hand...but he will understand why that machine's oil ought to be changed every 5000 Running hours.
Excelsior
Kaykay
#17 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 10:44:52 AM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 7/14/2011
Posts: 27
Location: Mombasa

I think there is a confusion about what to expect from University graduates.

There is such a thing as pure book keeping for which you require a technician (KATC) rather than a professional (CPA) or a draftsman rather than an architect. A B.com accounting graduate can only be referred to as an accountant after passing a professional accounting exam and practising for not less than 2 years.

Once you move away from book keeping and start considering financial management or management accounting, try the technician and you get into trouble instantly. At the grad/CPA/ACCA/CFA level, you have to understand that you are training someone to become a manager/key decision maker in 3 - 5 yrs. If your CPA candidate started at KATC level because (s)he did not qualify to directly sit the CPA exam, chances are that all you can train them to become is junior level management- can never see the big picture and is always caught in the nitty gritty of every day life.

I think we all need to (i)define what we expect from graduates (ii) improve recruitment practices - most of the time this is where Company's, recruiters fail (iii) Be willing to train and not expect instant solutions - this is called investing

The kind of graduate we end up with says a lot about who we are as recruiters. May be, we should start by looking at ourselves and laying the blame squarely at our door steps.

[/quote]


well said
jguru
#18 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 11:13:06 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 10/25/2007
Posts: 1,574
alma wrote:
I say cost, because most graduates have no value. They want to get a job! Not create value in any organisation. If you can prove value, then someone will pay you well. If you prove cost, then you get paid cost.


Very well said. If all employees would work as if they owned the organisation or a big share of it, then profits and productivity would be higher.
Set out to correct the world's wrongs and you will most certainly wind up adding to them.
webish
#19 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 11:24:19 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 10/19/2009
Posts: 667
Location: Nairobi
Kaykay wrote:
2012 wrote:
Gordon Gekko wrote:
In my small sphere of work, I get better value from technicians out of polytechnics, better accounts staff from CPA graduates. I have been hugely disappointed by the so called graduates seconded to me.


That's very true! It's because our national universities teach 1970 theories while poly teaches practical and application and I think that's why most university graduates are employees.


Why not invest in good recruitment practices?


EXACTLY!! Applause Applause Applause Applause Applause

Life is joy, death is peace, but the transition is very difficult.
addidaskawembe
#20 Posted : Friday, October 28, 2011 1:12:40 PM
Rank: New-farer


Joined: 5/14/2010
Posts: 84
Location: Nairobi
@new investor, I will give you an honest assessment out of my 18+ years experience in recruitment and management.

Most companies recruit attitude and then train the skills on the job, it’s no longer about degree’s & papers only.

Companies are looking for people who are innovative and are ready to take initiative without being reminded, people who are solution driven and can think out of the box.

Good recruiters can detect this during interviews from how your CV looks, what you have done during and after your university days.

Our current university products are mostly lazy, cannot take initiative, all they think of is earning big salaries and working for big companies simply because they have papers.

I have even seen people rushing to arm themselves with Masters e.g. MBA’s so that they can bargain higher salaries and earn more yet they cannot deliver anything.

Do your own research and you will confirm that most of our so called graduates cannot even express themselves in both oral and written, their writing skill is highly wanting with too much SMS style colloquia.

I can give you numerous examples of mid level college products I have personally recruited who have outshone the so called graduates, no wonder now days graduates are offered much less than they think they are worth.

By the way university education is supposed to equip graduates to become EMPLOYERS not EMPLOYEES.


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