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22 Pages«<1819202122>
Why dustbowl is the future
wukan
#381 Posted : Saturday, August 24, 2019 2:20:56 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 1,183
MugundaMan wrote:
wukan,
Did he crush your ngara bedsitter dreams?Laughing out loudly
Nairobi today is like Detroit in 1950. The rush to the gated communities in the burbs is on!! Zubaa at your own risk.


No at all, I love the funky downtown-the restaurants, the streets filled with people chasing their dreams, beautiful city lights, beautiful refreshing girls. I can meet everyone within a walking distance and strike all the deals I want. I have no time for burbs and fancy gated communities. Nairobi is like Shenzhen in 1980 everything is changing.
wukan
#382 Posted : Saturday, August 24, 2019 2:26:31 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 1,183
NewMoney wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
wukan,
Did he crush your ngara bedsitter dreams?Laughing out loudly
Nairobi today is like Detroit in 1950. The rush to the gated communities in the burbs is on!! Zubaa at your own risk.


The writer above is writing from a retirees perspective and with that premise, his assertions are right.

BUT, there is a big BUT, the average Kenyan is below 25 years old and these are the drivers of the economy and these are not going to DC anytime soon and a good percentage of them will make good money to continue pushing the economy of Nairobi's inner city to new heights.

Last I checked Kenya's life expectancy was around 60 years or less. So, better target the younger ones of us if you want growth, even banks, telecoms, e.t.c know this


Applause
MugundaMan
#383 Posted : Saturday, August 24, 2019 3:48:00 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/8/2018
Posts: 1,885
Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
NewMoney wrote:


The writer above is writing from a retirees perspective and with that premise, his assertions are right.

BUT, there is a big BUT, the average Kenyan is below 25 years old and these are the drivers of the economy and these are not going to DC anytime soon and a good percentage of them will make good money to continue pushing the economy of Nairobi's inner city to new heights.

Last I checked Kenya's life expectancy was around 60 years or less. So, better target the younger ones of us if you want growth, even banks, telecoms, e.t.c know this


The sweeping yet grossly erroneous assertions you make simply amaze me beyond words, my braddah. Where did you pull your facts on this? Have you been on a single site visit with property companies any time in the past 10 years. I have written about it severally here on wazoo from personal experience.The vast majority of buy and build property seekers in DC are well below 45! In fact the bulk of those are under 35! And they are moving to DC ( I am getting tired of repeating this) simply because of supply and demand. A 35 year old earning 80k a month has simply NO HOPE of owning in
Runda, Westlands or even South C due to land prices. Where do you expect them to go? Unless you are the first human being to ever have the capacity to repeal the law of supply and demand, YOU CANNOT stop the large whooshing sound of young Nairobians moving to DC. Wakina Mugundaman are hardly traditional retirees over 65 my braddah, even though technically we retired unofficially after cashing out months before the dot com bust of 2001smile
"The fool says in his heart, "There is no God." - Psalm 14:1**Dustbowl County is the Future of Kenya. Join us investing here or perish!!****On Vacation until Jan 1st 2020**Current NSE holdings:ZERO. Next planned re-entry into the NSE: 2052
MugundaMan
#384 Posted : Saturday, August 24, 2019 3:52:40 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/8/2018
Posts: 1,885
Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
wukan wrote:
MugundaMan wrote:
wukan,
Did he crush your ngara bedsitter dreams?Laughing out loudly
Nairobi today is like Detroit in 1950. The rush to the gated communities in the burbs is on!! Zubaa at your own risk.


No at all, I love the funky downtown-the restaurants, the streets filled with people chasing their dreams, beautiful city lights, beautiful refreshing girls. I can meet everyone within a walking distance and strike all the deals I want. I have no time for burbs and fancy gated communities. Nairobi is like Shenzhen in 1980 everything is changing.


Wukan,
This is all subjective. Mulmulwas Mugundaman also loves doing ndombolo on his portico in DC and watching swarms of goats amble along the horizon but im sure this means nothing to the rest of the planet because it is subjective. ROI, cap gains,etc are the only things relevant to us property owners hapa Wazoo.
"The fool says in his heart, "There is no God." - Psalm 14:1**Dustbowl County is the Future of Kenya. Join us investing here or perish!!****On Vacation until Jan 1st 2020**Current NSE holdings:ZERO. Next planned re-entry into the NSE: 2052
MugundaMan
#385 Posted : Sunday, August 25, 2019 9:18:53 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/8/2018
Posts: 1,885
Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
Ever wondered why Kitengela boomed as Athi River faltered? Now you know..


http://www.kenyafreepres...-faltered--now-you-know

Quote:
So, what explains Kitengela's fortunes? It's worth noting that the town began with the subdivision of the Kitengela Group Ranch, made up of 18,292ha, in 1988 in efforts by the government to encourage private land ownership.


Quote:
One of the ironies of the Nairobi property market is the rapid rise of Kitengela township while its neighbour Athi River foundered. For starters, Athi River is one of Kenya's oldest towns. Founded in the colonial period, it was home to the Kenya Meat Commission and a host of other manufacturing companies for decades. The town also sits on the Nairobi-Mombasa highway.

But those who have known and lived in Athi River marvel at the fast rise of Kitengela town. Though Athi River had a population of 139,380 people - more than double the 58,167 of Kitengela - in the 2009 census, that's perhaps the only measure by which it towers above its southern neighbour, which started only in 1988.

Athi River has a geographical area of 6,930ha, which pales in comparison to Kitengela's 18,292ha. Athi River is renowned for its polluted waters, unplanned development, encroachment by unscrupulous investors on riparian lands and yawnin lack of social amenities. Kitengela, on the other hand, is supremely gifted with all these.

For Athi River residents, a stark reminder that their town is stuck in a time rut comes every weekend as they see fleets of cars cruising out of Nairobi making their way to 'Kite' which is famous for its nyama choma joints. The first thing which captures your attention as you approach Kitengela is the construction boom. Each day, a new building is completed as the foundation of another is dug elsewhere.

The town boats numerous educational institutions, including the main campuses of KCA University, the East African University and Umma University as well as middle level colleges like Path Institute and Riccati Business College, among others. Primary and secondary schools are too many to enumerate, including high-cost ones offering international curriculums. Athi River has no colleges to write about.

Supermarkets in Kitengela are thriving, given the huge purchasing power of the residents. Famous brands like EastMatt Supermarket, Acacia Supermarket and Naivas have all pitched tent in the town. Naivas just recently re-opened their branch at the new Mega Kitengela Mall. While both Both Kitengela and Athi River are located in dry lands, stymieing agricultural development, Kite does have many small-scale urban farmers.

So, what explains Kitengela's fortunes? It's worth noting that the town began with the subdivision of the Kitengela Group Ranch, made up of 18,292ha, in 1988 in efforts by the government to encourage private land ownership. This was done with the goal to intensify and commercialise livestock production. Early beneficiaries of the subdivision, just 6,548 residents in 1989 census, quickly developed the town, resulting in its quick population growth.

During the country's economic boom in the early 2000s, as the dream to own a home drove Nairobi's middle-class into areas once shunned by many, Kitengela experienced an unprecedented property boom. Alex Muema, Managing Director of Ndatani Enterprises Limited, said Kitengela is preferred because of good transport and weather.

The same did not apply for Athi River, which, with its many manufacturing plants, attracted only the semi-skilled labour force. Without commensurate investment in social services, Athi River began to decline, leading even its affluent workers to relocate to Kite.

Compared to other young suburbs of Nairobi, Kitengela is home to many famous Kenyans. The late Internal Security Minister George Saitoti owned one of the largest business centers in the town, where Kenya Commercial Bank is one of the main tenants.

John Munyes, the former Turkana Senator and current cabinet secretary for mining, also owns a residential mansion house in Kitengela, as does journalist Yvonne Okwara.



As I have been harping hapa for dog years, all this is a no-brainer. The funny thing is naysayers STILL want to argue against the DC boom -some even saying it is "non-existent" (always without providing even an iota of evidence outside their own opinions) Laughing out loudly

Cold hard economic logic, not emotions is driving the boom. Little old Mugundaman would NEVER have been able to afford the space and quality of life he enjoys in DC had he chosen to stick to cramped and overpriced Nairobi where an 1/8th is going for hundreds of millions! And no way he will be caught dead rotting in sijui an apartment in Valley Arcade or bedsitter in Ngara living like a university teenager with clothes hanging out of the cramped balcony.


No matter how high end the apartment is. I need space to walk, jog, breathe, have BBQ's in the gazebo, and grow all sorts of exotic trees for fun bila msukosuko mob. Can't do that in Nairobi core unless you live in Muthaiga and can afford 400m. And this is repeated in Ngong, Tuala, Ronga, Kiserian, Kona Baridi and so many other DC boom towns. Why people are opposed to it baffles me. There is a reason why Kajiado North for example is often considered the richest constituency in Kenya. Smart, young and old Middle class Nairobians who want to secure their long term future for themselves and their families have all moved there.

Ni hayo maoni yangu tu!
"The fool says in his heart, "There is no God." - Psalm 14:1**Dustbowl County is the Future of Kenya. Join us investing here or perish!!****On Vacation until Jan 1st 2020**Current NSE holdings:ZERO. Next planned re-entry into the NSE: 2052
FRM2011
#386 Posted : Sunday, August 25, 2019 10:12:17 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 11/5/2010
Posts: 2,379
@mugundaman, sometimes you come across as a veteran of kitengela, then when you enthusiastically share the above article written by an MKU student, I get my doubts.

The author has no idea what he is talking about, which is understandable considering their age.

About 3 families own all the prime land in athi river. They don't sell. The ndeti family's holding is close to 1,000 acres. Kitengela on the other hand always has prime properties for sale. The nonkopir side even today is virtually undeveloped. And we are talking 500M-1KM from namanga road.

There is zero planning in athi river. You will find a beautiful mansion next to a massive factory.
Because of the above problem, there is crazy pollution in athi river.

While kitengela titles are freehold, in athi river they are leasehold properties.
On top of all these problems, saitoti pulled a smart move that pushed kitengela miles ahead. The EPZ is in athi river and machakos administratively but the main entrance is on the kitengela side. Saitoti even managed to get the EPZ to share its water with residents of kitengela. Around the year 2005, EPZ had 20,000 employees.

There is an exception though. There is an area called embakasi in athi river. These are the people moved by mzee kenyatta from embakasi to pave way for JKIA. The area has the cleanest titles. Another place is the senior staff estate at the interchange. I would choose this place anyday over kitengela. Sewer line, clean water, organised estate.
MugundaMan
#387 Posted : Sunday, August 25, 2019 10:28:56 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/8/2018
Posts: 1,885
Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
FRM2011 wrote:
@mugundaman, sometimes you come across as a veteran of kitengela, then when you enthusiastically share the above article written by an MKU student, I get my doubts.

The author has no idea what he is talking about, which is understandable considering their age.

About 3 families own all the prime land in athi river. They don't sell. The ndeti family's holding is close to 1,000 acres. Kitengela on the other hand always has prime properties for sale. The nonkopir side even today is virtually undeveloped. And we are talking 500M-1KM from namanga road.

There is zero planning in athi river. You will find a beautiful mansion next to a massive factory.
Because of the above problem, there is crazy pollution in athi river.

While kitengela titles are freehold, in athi river they are leasehold properties.
On top of all these problems, saitoti pulled a smart move that pushed kitengela miles ahead. The EPZ is in athi river and machakos administratively but the main entrance is on the kitengela side. Saitoti even managed to get the EPZ to share its water with residents of kitengela. Around the year 2005, EPZ had 20,000 employees.

There is an exception though. There is an area called embakasi in athi river. These are the people moved by mzee kenyatta from embakasi to pave way for JKIA. The area has the cleanest titles. Another place is the senior staff estate at the interchange. I would choose this place anyday over kitengela. Sewer line, clean water, organised estate.



Thanks for the history lesson, but how does that add ugali to our tables? Laughing out loudly And how does that negate anything I have said on this other thread about DC being the future? In that respect I will go with the MKU students thesis any day over your long insha that has not told us anything to negate DC being the future :)
"The fool says in his heart, "There is no God." - Psalm 14:1**Dustbowl County is the Future of Kenya. Join us investing here or perish!!****On Vacation until Jan 1st 2020**Current NSE holdings:ZERO. Next planned re-entry into the NSE: 2052
hardwood
#388 Posted : Sunday, August 25, 2019 11:11:54 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,328
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
An individual's housing needs change over time. Thus when:

-College student - bedsitter
-Employed single person - 1 bedroom flat
-Married couple without children - 1 bedroom flat
-married with 1 small kid and house girl - 2 bedroom flat
-married with 1 big kid and house girl - 3 bedroom flat
-married with 2 kids & house girl - 3 bdrm flat or maisonette
-married with 2 or 3 teenagers and H/girl - 4 bdrm maisonette + servants quarter
-Retired couple - maisonette + servants quarter

Therefore as one can see above as the family grows they will need to move from communal housing (flats) to private housing (maisonette) and the sooner they work on getting a stand-alone house the better. And with no affordable maisonettes within the city, dustbowl is the future.

Also as a man there is no greater joy than having your own house and compound to raise your family. A place where you can also host friends and relatives and kula mbuzi and enjoy muratina under a tree hapo inje.

sparkly
#389 Posted : Sunday, August 25, 2019 11:39:55 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/23/2009
Posts: 7,210
Location: Enk are Nyirobi
hardwood wrote:
An individual's housing needs changes over time. Thus:

-College student - bedsitter
-Employed single person - 1 bedroom flat
-Married couple without children - 1 bedroom flat
-married with 1 small kid and house girl - 2 bedroom flat
-married with 1 big kid and house girl - 3 bedroom flat
-married with 2 kids & house girl - 3 bdrm flat or maisonette
-married with 2 or 3 teenagers and H/girl - 4 bdrm maisonette + servants quarter
-Retired couple - maisonette + servants quarter

Therefore as one can see above as the family grows they will need to move from communal housing (flats) to private housing (maisonette) and the sooner they work on getting one the better. And with no affordable maisonettes within the city, dustbowl is the future.

Also as a man there is no greater joy than having your own house and compound to raise your family. A place where you can also host friends and relatives and kula mbuzi and enjoy muratina under a tree hapo inje.



From your african working class perspective smile smile There are people who are born and live in palaces all their lives. Others like CBK Governor Njoroge live in hostels all their lives.
Life is short. Live passionately.
obiero
#390 Posted : Sunday, August 25, 2019 12:19:41 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 12,179
Location: nairobi
sparkly wrote:
hardwood wrote:
An individual's housing needs changes over time. Thus:

-College student - bedsitter
-Employed single person - 1 bedroom flat
-Married couple without children - 1 bedroom flat
-married with 1 small kid and house girl - 2 bedroom flat
-married with 1 big kid and house girl - 3 bedroom flat
-married with 2 kids & house girl - 3 bdrm flat or maisonette
-married with 2 or 3 teenagers and H/girl - 4 bdrm maisonette + servants quarter
-Retired couple - maisonette + servants quarter

Therefore as one can see above as the family grows they will need to move from communal housing (flats) to private housing (maisonette) and the sooner they work on getting one the better. And with no affordable maisonettes within the city, dustbowl is the future.

Also as a man there is no greater joy than having your own house and compound to raise your family. A place where you can also host friends and relatives and kula mbuzi and enjoy muratina under a tree hapo inje.



From your african working class perspective smile smile There are people who are born and live in palaces all their lives. Others like CBK Governor Njoroge live in hostels all their lives.

Opus Dei is an exception with his bedsitter
COOP 5,500; KCB 7,500; KNRE 100,000; KQ 221,100
hardwood
#391 Posted : Sunday, August 25, 2019 2:45:24 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/28/2015
Posts: 9,328
Location: Rodi Kopany, Homa Bay
wukan wrote:
The author needs to travel HongKong, Singapore, China. It will change his perspective on how the future will be.


Hongkong and singapore are tiny islands with no land to expand to thus the high rise apartments. Nairobi is different coz it has lots of neighbouring lands especially dustbowl and kiambu coffee farms to expand to.

Also you cant compare the filthy kirinyaga rd and grogon to hongkong. How can someone even live in that garbage and chokora infested kirinyaga rd? How do you and your kids and wife get home from work and school?

http://nairobiwire.com/w...ploads/2017/04/jag3.jpg





maka
#392 Posted : Sunday, August 25, 2019 7:41:30 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 4/22/2010
Posts: 11,168
Location: Nairobi
Jana on my way to Kiserian I used the Karen - Ngong - Matasia route... Seems like the road is being dualled after Ngong going to Kiserian...
possunt quia posse videntur
obiero
#393 Posted : Sunday, August 25, 2019 8:08:04 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 12,179
Location: nairobi
maka wrote:
Jana on my way to Kiserian I used the Karen - Ngong - Matasia route... Seems like the road is being dualled after Ngong going to Kiserian...

That's the same one going all the way to Suswa
COOP 5,500; KCB 7,500; KNRE 100,000; KQ 221,100
Swenani
#394 Posted : Monday, August 26, 2019 11:42:08 AM
Rank: User


Joined: 8/15/2013
Posts: 13,038
Location: Vacuum
Mimi iko Nairobi kusomesha watoto nikitafuta pesa, nikimalisana na hayo, I relocate back to ingo where the future of Kenya lies
Poverty is the root of all evil
wukan
#395 Posted : Monday, August 26, 2019 3:07:46 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 1,183
hardwood wrote:
wukan wrote:
The author needs to travel HongKong, Singapore, China. It will change his perspective on how the future will be.


Hongkong and singapore are tiny islands with no land to expand to thus the high rise apartments. Nairobi is different coz it has lots of neighbouring lands especially dustbowl and kiambu coffee farms to expand to.

Also you cant compare the filthy kirinyaga rd and grogon to hongkong. How can someone even live in that garbage and chokora infested kirinyaga rd? How do you and your kids and wife get home from work and school?




Cities are tiny islands in a way. They are not meant to sprawl all the way to the countryside. Nairobi was meant to have an urban boundary zone and squeeze people into planned space. The National park and the kiambu coffee farms were meant to be buffer zones separating the urban and rural areas hence the likes of Joreth, Donholm, Runda Karen farms.

As for Hongkong surely you can't compare some of the areas there like Kowloon with Kirinyaga road. We are not anywhere near.You should see some dirty streets https://allthatsinterest....com/littering-in-china
or san Francisco's poop menace and chokora problem yet more tourists going there
https://www.sfchronicle....urism-hits-13688538.php

Also Dustbowl will see the same dirty streets in some few years, where will you sprawl to? That's the future...deal with it.

MugundaMan
#396 Posted : Monday, August 26, 2019 3:59:13 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/8/2018
Posts: 1,885
Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
wukan wrote:

Cities are tiny islands in a way. They are not meant to sprawl all the way to the countryside. Nairobi was meant to have an urban boundary zone and squeeze people into planned space. The National park and the kiambu coffee farms were meant to be buffer zones separating the urban and rural areas hence the likes of Joreth, Donholm, Runda Karen farms.

As for Hongkong surely you can't compare some of the areas there like Kowloon with Kirinyaga road. We are not anywhere near.You should see some dirty streets https://allthatsinterest....com/littering-in-china
or san Francisco's poop menace and chokora problem yet more tourists going there
https://www.sfchronicle....urism-hits-13688538.php

Also Dustbowl will see the same dirty streets in some few years, where will you sprawl to? That's the future...deal with it.



Wukan,
But werent you the one here bragging about peeing contests, and about how Luthuli avenue is now Nirvana compared to DC? Funny that all that bragging has been reduced to the feeble whimper "but Hong Kong and SanFran are dirty too and so will DC be in a few years" Laughing out loudly

Maanjab kweli kweli
"The fool says in his heart, "There is no God." - Psalm 14:1**Dustbowl County is the Future of Kenya. Join us investing here or perish!!****On Vacation until Jan 1st 2020**Current NSE holdings:ZERO. Next planned re-entry into the NSE: 2052
MugundaMan
#397 Posted : Monday, August 26, 2019 4:04:39 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 1/8/2018
Posts: 1,885
Location: DC (Dustbowl County)
Swenani wrote:
Mimi iko Nairobi kusomesha watoto nikitafuta pesa, nikimalisana na hayo, I relocate back to ingo where the future of Kenya lies


The problem with shaggz areas is property issues are shrouded in mysticism and extremely strong community ties. If Swenani for example built a palatial 10m mansion in shaggz, it would literally become a "dead" investment because he would not be able to rent it or sell it to anyone in his lifetime except perhaps to the village mganga. That alone will make the cap gain growth rate very slow. If he built it in DC, however, it will sell or rent like hotcake and one simple mansion can easily be his retirement tiko.
"The fool says in his heart, "There is no God." - Psalm 14:1**Dustbowl County is the Future of Kenya. Join us investing here or perish!!****On Vacation until Jan 1st 2020**Current NSE holdings:ZERO. Next planned re-entry into the NSE: 2052
wukan
#398 Posted : Monday, August 26, 2019 4:37:07 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 11/13/2015
Posts: 1,183
MugundaMan wrote:
wukan wrote:

Cities are tiny islands in a way. They are not meant to sprawl all the way to the countryside. Nairobi was meant to have an urban boundary zone and squeeze people into planned space. The National park and the kiambu coffee farms were meant to be buffer zones separating the urban and rural areas hence the likes of Joreth, Donholm, Runda Karen farms.

As for Hongkong surely you can't compare some of the areas there like Kowloon with Kirinyaga road. We are not anywhere near.You should see some dirty streets https://allthatsinterest....com/littering-in-china
or san Francisco's poop menace and chokora problem yet more tourists going there
https://www.sfchronicle....urism-hits-13688538.php

Also Dustbowl will see the same dirty streets in some few years, where will you sprawl to? That's the future...deal with it.



Wukan,
But werent you the one here bragging about peeing contests, and about how Luthuli avenue is now Nirvana compared to DC? Funny that all that bragging has been reduced to the feeble whimper "but Hong Kong and SanFran are dirty too and so will DC be in a few years" Laughing out loudly

Maanjab kweli kweli


Streets get cleaned up and it's a very easy thing to do. Luthuli Ave is a good example. Meanwhile those dirty streets don't stop people going there.

Lots of good things about to happen to clean up the streets in the next few years. Be patient if you see a place with rental yield of 13% iko kitu. Your Mrs. will be telling you I want to be near CBD very soon. You see even your Artcaffe people are running to open flagship branch in CBD https://www.businessdail...8750-1nwh1nz/index.html

Your gated community kids will not have the street smarts to survive the future streets. They need to learn these tough streets now.
gatoho
#399 Posted : Monday, August 26, 2019 10:15:00 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/1/2010
Posts: 505
Location: kandara, Murang'a
Is Sholinke in the dust bowl? And how are plots sold by Daykio there doing?
Foresight..
tinker
#400 Posted : Tuesday, August 27, 2019 6:53:39 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/15/2010
Posts: 371
Location: Nairobi
gatoho wrote:
Is Sholinke in the dust bowl? And how are plots sold by Daykio there doing?
.

Yes,Sholinge is in DC, you can approach it either via Kite or Via Ronga.
....He who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion..
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