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8 Pages<12345>»
US - China tariffs war
murchr
#41 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 3:43:19 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 14,481
2012 wrote:
murchr wrote:
Google is now being controlled by the US government same crime that Trump is accusing Huawei of. Not good at all.


If China banns Apple, Apple would lose 30% of their business.


The Chinese are already boycotting the phone that's why Apple had to lower its revenue forecast.

Now the interesting part is the phone's supply chain is largely Chinese and moving that to another country is close to impossible.
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
mpobiz
#42 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 4:27:34 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 8/10/2010
Posts: 1,689
I think this war is not US and China it's US+EU against China. China will loose wakubali mapema. Once this wazungu come after you better surrender or else end like Saddam and Iraq
Politics is just things to keep the people divided and foolish and put your trust in men and none of them can do nothing for you...
murchr
#43 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 4:30:31 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 14,481
mpobiz wrote:
I think this war is not US and China it's US+EU against China. China will loose wakubali mapema. Once this wazungu come after you better surrender or else end like Saddam and Iraq


EU have been reluctant in agreeing with Trump on Huawei. Actually there are no changes in taxes btn China and EU, but Trump has tariffs on EU stuff entering the US market
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
2012
#44 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 4:59:37 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,357
Location: Nairobi
murchr wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
I think this war is not US and China it's US+EU against China. China will loose wakubali mapema. Once this wazungu come after you better surrender or else end like Saddam and Iraq


EU have been reluctant in agreeing with Trump on Huawei. Actually there are no changes in taxes btn China and EU, but Trump has tariffs on EU stuff entering the US market


EU is too divided to speak in one voice. Of course most don't like China but they don't want to be against China because they could be their only savior when things get thick. It's the same with Africa. The Chinese are nobody's friends.

Stand for something or you will fall for anything. Today's mighty oak is yesterday's nut that held its ground. Rosa Parks
Rollout
#45 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 5:15:24 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/26/2011
Posts: 712
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
murchr wrote:
Google is now being controlled by the US government same crime that Trump is accusing Huawei of. Not good at all.


If China banns Apple, Apple would lose 30% of their business.


China should shut Apple manufacturing factories which are all located in china and cripple apple 100%.


Shutting down Apple Manufacturing facilities will not happen because it will be the beginning of the end of China communist party. The ripple effect will lead to collapse of the GOV and the ruling elites know that.

1. There will be immediate mass unemployment associated with Apple factories closure

2. It will signal other foreign manufactures that its time to open shops in other East Asia countries leading to a ripple and graduate shift of production by other companies to other countries creating a compounding long term increase unemployment.

3. China need technology and they are learning by having apple and other companies in their country.

With high unemployment the economy will slow down and the party will loose support from the masses
mpobiz
#46 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 5:30:48 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 8/10/2010
Posts: 1,689
Rollout wrote:
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
murchr wrote:
Google is now being controlled by the US government same crime that Trump is accusing Huawei of. Not good at all.


If China banns Apple, Apple would lose 30% of their business.


China should shut Apple manufacturing factories which are all located in china and cripple apple 100%.


Shutting down Apple Manufacturing facilities will not happen because it will be the beginning of the end of China communist party. The ripple effect will lead to collapse of the GOV and the ruling elites know that.

1. There will be immediate mass unemployment associated with Apple factories closure

2. It will signal other foreign manufactures that its time to open shops in other East Asia countries leading to a ripple and graduate shift of production by other companies to other countries creating a compounding long term increase unemployment.

3. China need technology and they are learning by having apple and other companies in their country.

With high unemployment the economy will slow down and the party will loose support from the masses

My thoughts exactly. China is in no position to bully any western country. All its manufacturing and all its market is in the west. Now that the west has seen that China is trying to show that its growing some balls. Manufacturing wil soon be moving to other Asian countries like Vietnam Thailand and Indonesia . Taiwan is also another destination.
Politics is just things to keep the people divided and foolish and put your trust in men and none of them can do nothing for you...
murchr
#47 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 5:47:56 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 14,481
mpobiz wrote:
Rollout wrote:
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
murchr wrote:
Google is now being controlled by the US government same crime that Trump is accusing Huawei of. Not good at all.


If China banns Apple, Apple would lose 30% of their business.


China should shut Apple manufacturing factories which are all located in china and cripple apple 100%.


Shutting down Apple Manufacturing facilities will not happen because it will be the beginning of the end of China communist party. The ripple effect will lead to collapse of the GOV and the ruling elites know that.

1. There will be immediate mass unemployment associated with Apple factories closure

2. It will signal other foreign manufactures that its time to open shops in other East Asia countries leading to a ripple and graduate shift of production by other companies to other countries creating a compounding long term increase unemployment.

3. China need technology and they are learning by having apple and other companies in their country.

With high unemployment the economy will slow down and the party will loose support from the masses

My thoughts exactly. China is in no position to bully any western country. All its manufacturing and all its market is in the west. Now that the west has seen that China is trying to show that its growing some balls. Manufacturing wil soon be moving to other Asian countries like Vietnam Thailand and Indonesia . Taiwan is also another destination.


That will be a long shot. Manufacturing is not just building factories, you will have to train those workers to be as efficient as those of the country you are leaving so I do not see any company making that kind of move.

These companies also want to sell to the 1B chinese population so leaving also implies leaving behind that market that they will find no where else.

That's why Walmart has alerted their customers to expect higher prices

Currently, Trump hasnt slapped tariffs on Apple products but if he imposes it on the rest of the items then the prices of Apple phones is bound to go up
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
tycho
#48 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 6:07:12 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/1/2011
Posts: 8,455
Location: Nairobi
I wonder if these tariff wars will not spin off to other kinds of wars especially in other geographical regions, just like the cold war might have causes proxy wars and instability like in Africa.
mpobiz
#49 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 6:33:25 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 8/10/2010
Posts: 1,689
murchr wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
Rollout wrote:
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
murchr wrote:
Google is now being controlled by the US government same crime that Trump is accusing Huawei of. Not good at all.


If China banns Apple, Apple would lose 30% of their business.


China should shut Apple manufacturing factories which are all located in china and cripple apple 100%.


Shutting down Apple Manufacturing facilities will not happen because it will be the beginning of the end of China communist party. The ripple effect will lead to collapse of the GOV and the ruling elites know that.

1. There will be immediate mass unemployment associated with Apple factories closure

2. It will signal other foreign manufactures that its time to open shops in other East Asia countries leading to a ripple and graduate shift of production by other companies to other countries creating a compounding long term increase unemployment.

3. China need technology and they are learning by having apple and other companies in their country.

With high unemployment the economy will slow down and the party will loose support from the masses

My thoughts exactly. China is in no position to bully any western country. All its manufacturing and all its market is in the west. Now that the west has seen that China is trying to show that its growing some balls. Manufacturing wil soon be moving to other Asian countries like Vietnam Thailand and Indonesia . Taiwan is also another destination.


That will be a long shot. Manufacturing is not just building factories, you will have to train those workers to be as efficient as those of the country you are leaving so I do not see any company making that kind of move.

These companies also want to sell to the 1B chinese population so leaving also implies leaving behind that market that they will find no where else.

That's why Walmart has alerted their customers to expect higher prices

Currently, Trump hasnt slapped tariffs on Apple products but if he imposes it on the rest of the items then the prices of Apple phones is bound to go up

The 1b market you are talking about is only made up of peasants. That's not the target market for Americans or EU. They will move elsewhere very fast. They will gamble and create efficiency elsewhere. I once saw on tv how Boeing constructed a factory from scratch and started making planes. If Africa had the right infrastructure like power and ports .. they could move here too we also have a 1b population(market)
Politics is just things to keep the people divided and foolish and put your trust in men and none of them can do nothing for you...
murchr
#50 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 7:34:05 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 14,481
mpobiz wrote:
murchr wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
Rollout wrote:
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
murchr wrote:
Google is now being controlled by the US government same crime that Trump is accusing Huawei of. Not good at all.


If China banns Apple, Apple would lose 30% of their business.


China should shut Apple manufacturing factories which are all located in china and cripple apple 100%.


Shutting down Apple Manufacturing facilities will not happen because it will be the beginning of the end of China communist party. The ripple effect will lead to collapse of the GOV and the ruling elites know that.

1. There will be immediate mass unemployment associated with Apple factories closure

2. It will signal other foreign manufactures that its time to open shops in other East Asia countries leading to a ripple and graduate shift of production by other companies to other countries creating a compounding long term increase unemployment.

3. China need technology and they are learning by having apple and other companies in their country.

With high unemployment the economy will slow down and the party will loose support from the masses

My thoughts exactly. China is in no position to bully any western country. All its manufacturing and all its market is in the west. Now that the west has seen that China is trying to show that its growing some balls. Manufacturing wil soon be moving to other Asian countries like Vietnam Thailand and Indonesia . Taiwan is also another destination.


That will be a long shot. Manufacturing is not just building factories, you will have to train those workers to be as efficient as those of the country you are leaving so I do not see any company making that kind of move.

These companies also want to sell to the 1B chinese population so leaving also implies leaving behind that market that they will find no where else.

That's why Walmart has alerted their customers to expect higher prices

Currently, Trump hasnt slapped tariffs on Apple products but if he imposes it on the rest of the items then the prices of Apple phones is bound to go up


The 1b market you are talking about is only made up of peasants. That's not the target market for Americans or EU. They will move elsewhere very fast. They will gamble and create efficiency elsewhere. I once saw on tv how Boeing constructed a factory from scratch and started making planes. If Africa had the right infrastructure like power and ports .. they could move here too we also have a 1b population(market)



You are a joke.

The Chinese middle class comprises of 420million people - That is more than the entire population of America.

McKinsey predicts 75% of the urban population will be termed as middle class in 2022.



The U.S. has taken the path of —deregulation, anti-labor laws, free trade, privatization, slashing social services, and letting banks run wild on speculation. The purpose was to enrich the top 1% by cutting labor costs through offshoring, and other programs.

China did the opposite—it built up manufacturing, continued to heavily regulate the economy and plan for it, maintained a nationalized financial system, and has been implementing retirement and healthcare benefits for its people.

The results speak for themselves



Boeing building a factory from scratch involved money expertise and labor no? Where else has Boeing operated. I know they opened a plant in China in December even with the tariff noise.

Note companies will always take the easy way out. Pass that extra bill to the consumer. If anything, China will manipulate the Yuan


Tesla
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
Rollout
#51 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 8:36:48 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/26/2011
Posts: 712
murchr wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
murchr wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
Rollout wrote:
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
murchr wrote:
Google is now being controlled by the US government same crime that Trump is accusing Huawei of. Not good at all.


If China banns Apple, Apple would lose 30% of their business.


China should shut Apple manufacturing factories which are all located in china and cripple apple 100%.


Shutting down Apple Manufacturing facilities will not happen because it will be the beginning of the end of China communist party. The ripple effect will lead to collapse of the GOV and the ruling elites know that.

1. There will be immediate mass unemployment associated with Apple factories closure

2. It will signal other foreign manufactures that its time to open shops in other East Asia countries leading to a ripple and graduate shift of production by other companies to other countries creating a compounding long term increase unemployment.

3. China need technology and they are learning by having apple and other companies in their country.

With high unemployment the economy will slow down and the party will loose support from the masses

My thoughts exactly. China is in no position to bully any western country. All its manufacturing and all its market is in the west. Now that the west has seen that China is trying to show that its growing some balls. Manufacturing wil soon be moving to other Asian countries like Vietnam Thailand and Indonesia . Taiwan is also another destination.


That will be a long shot. Manufacturing is not just building factories, you will have to train those workers to be as efficient as those of the country you are leaving so I do not see any company making that kind of move.

These companies also want to sell to the 1B chinese population so leaving also implies leaving behind that market that they will find no where else.

That's why Walmart has alerted their customers to expect higher prices

Currently, Trump hasnt slapped tariffs on Apple products but if he imposes it on the rest of the items then the prices of Apple phones is bound to go up


The 1b market you are talking about is only made up of peasants. That's not the target market for Americans or EU. They will move elsewhere very fast. They will gamble and create efficiency elsewhere. I once saw on tv how Boeing constructed a factory from scratch and started making planes. If Africa had the right infrastructure like power and ports .. they could move here too we also have a 1b population(market)



You are a joke.

The Chinese middle class comprises of 420million people - That is more than the entire population of America.

McKinsey predicts 75% of the urban population will be termed as middle class in 2022.



The U.S. has taken the path of —deregulation, anti-labor laws, free trade, privatization, slashing social services, and letting banks run wild on speculation. The purpose was to enrich the top 1% by cutting labor costs through offshoring, and other programs.

China did the opposite—it built up manufacturing, continued to heavily regulate the economy and plan for it, maintained a nationalized financial system, and has been implementing retirement and healthcare benefits for its people.

The results speak for themselves



Boeing building a factory from scratch involved money expertise and labor no? Where else has Boeing operated. I know they opened a plant in China in December even with the tariff noise.

Note companies will always take the easy way out. Pass that extra bill to the consumer. If anything, China will manipulate the Yuan


Tesla



One thing you don't understand is that majority/all manufacturing done in China by foreign companies are basically assembly lines, not high-tech manufacturing. These manufacturing are not done by trained engineers, they are done by cheap, not educated, Chinese population. You are basically trained to clue things together. It takes a week or so to train these kinds of labor. Apple for instant does all the design work in California and ship parts and Chips from other US based high tech manufactures to China for assembly.
madhaquer
#52 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 9:24:21 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 11/10/2010
Posts: 218
Location: Nairobi
But it takes a smart brain a few hours/days to reverse engineer even the best tech. This is the frustration of the US with China.

At the moment, Huawei is already sitting on enough of it's own intellectual property and patents to build 3G/4G/5G product lines from scratch. Thanks to a continuous increase in R&D investments year on year.

China has the capacity to manufacture practically everything on this planet. Good bye to US competitive advantage. China has cheap labour, access to raw materials and the rest of the world will be on hand to fill any gaps in R&D.

Blocking Huawei may be good for Apple and Samsung in the short term but the number of android compatible Chinese manufacturers has been growing. Will they all be banned too ?
Rollout
#53 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 9:41:04 PM
Rank: Member


Joined: 4/26/2011
Posts: 712
madhaquer wrote:
But it takes a smart brain a few hours/days to reverse engineer even the best tech. This is the frustration of the US with China.

At the moment, Huawei is already sitting on enough of it's own intellectual property and patents to build 3G/4G/5G product lines from scratch. Thanks to a continuous increase in R&D investments year on year.

China has the capacity to manufacture practically everything on this planet. Good bye to US competitive advantage. China has cheap labour, access to raw materials and the rest of the world will be on hand to fill any gaps in R&D.

Blocking Huawei may be good for Apple and Samsung in the short term but the number of android compatible Chinese manufacturers has been growing. Will they all be banned too ?


I agree that over time, Chinese will acquire the necessary technology however, I don't agree that china will reach there through reverse engineering and I don't agree that they have the capacity to manufacture practically everything.

To acquire the technology they have to partner rather than reverse engineer. Take for instance the iphone, you have technologies and parts/chips from multiple highly specialized high tech companies it will be cost ineffective to reverse engineer iphone because you will have to reverse engineer products and parts from different companies that are the best in their space.

US still have a big edge in terms of technology evolution, their universities and government have been research hub for over 70 yrs. Their universities attract the best and the brightest talents from all over the world and the success of capitalism ensures that the smartest talents are handsomely rewarded therefore keeping them from moving part to their countries. China will have to be able to attract top talents and reward them handsomely in order to succeed in order to compete in high tech.
murchr
#54 Posted : Monday, May 20, 2019 10:50:52 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 14,481
Rollout wrote:
murchr wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
murchr wrote:
mpobiz wrote:
Rollout wrote:
hardwood wrote:
2012 wrote:
murchr wrote:
Google is now being controlled by the US government same crime that Trump is accusing Huawei of. Not good at all.


If China banns Apple, Apple would lose 30% of their business.


China should shut Apple manufacturing factories which are all located in china and cripple apple 100%.


Shutting down Apple Manufacturing facilities will not happen because it will be the beginning of the end of China communist party. The ripple effect will lead to collapse of the GOV and the ruling elites know that.

1. There will be immediate mass unemployment associated with Apple factories closure

2. It will signal other foreign manufactures that its time to open shops in other East Asia countries leading to a ripple and graduate shift of production by other companies to other countries creating a compounding long term increase unemployment.

3. China need technology and they are learning by having apple and other companies in their country.

With high unemployment the economy will slow down and the party will loose support from the masses

My thoughts exactly. China is in no position to bully any western country. All its manufacturing and all its market is in the west. Now that the west has seen that China is trying to show that its growing some balls. Manufacturing wil soon be moving to other Asian countries like Vietnam Thailand and Indonesia . Taiwan is also another destination.


That will be a long shot. Manufacturing is not just building factories, you will have to train those workers to be as efficient as those of the country you are leaving so I do not see any company making that kind of move.

These companies also want to sell to the 1B chinese population so leaving also implies leaving behind that market that they will find no where else.

That's why Walmart has alerted their customers to expect higher prices

Currently, Trump hasnt slapped tariffs on Apple products but if he imposes it on the rest of the items then the prices of Apple phones is bound to go up


The 1b market you are talking about is only made up of peasants. That's not the target market for Americans or EU. They will move elsewhere very fast. They will gamble and create efficiency elsewhere. I once saw on tv how Boeing constructed a factory from scratch and started making planes. If Africa had the right infrastructure like power and ports .. they could move here too we also have a 1b population(market)



You are a joke.

The Chinese middle class comprises of 420million people - That is more than the entire population of America.

McKinsey predicts 75% of the urban population will be termed as middle class in 2022.



The U.S. has taken the path of —deregulation, anti-labor laws, free trade, privatization, slashing social services, and letting banks run wild on speculation. The purpose was to enrich the top 1% by cutting labor costs through offshoring, and other programs.

China did the opposite—it built up manufacturing, continued to heavily regulate the economy and plan for it, maintained a nationalized financial system, and has been implementing retirement and healthcare benefits for its people.

The results speak for themselves



Boeing building a factory from scratch involved money expertise and labor no? Where else has Boeing operated. I know they opened a plant in China in December even with the tariff noise.

Note companies will always take the easy way out. Pass that extra bill to the consumer. If anything, China will manipulate the Yuan


Tesla



One thing you don't understand is that majority/all manufacturing done in China by foreign companies are basically assembly lines, not high-tech manufacturing. These manufacturing are not done by trained engineers, they are done by cheap, not educated, Chinese population. You are basically trained to clue things together. It takes a week or so to train these kinds of labor. Apple for instant does all the design work in California and ship parts and Chips from other US based high tech manufactures to China for assembly.


What parts and chips are in the US?

All of the manufacturing know-how and supply chains for that type of device are in China and other Asian countries who have heavily invested in developing them over decades thanks to people (like US companies) buying their lower priced services. In the quest to drive down costs, many US based companies that knew how to build the parts of the iPhone and the iPhone itself have folded or migrated operations out of the United States.

The flex circuit connectors are made in China.

The electrophoretic display is made in Taiwan .

The highly polished injection-molded case is made in China.
The wireless card is made in South Korea.
The controller board is made in China.
The Lithium polymer battery is made in China

The logistics involved in bringing all these components together is imense plus thhe efficiencies offered by the Chinese worker are superior than others and it will take time (which no company can afford) to come up with a replica. Motorola tried with Moto-x.
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
mpobiz
#55 Posted : Tuesday, May 21, 2019 1:14:24 AM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 8/10/2010
Posts: 1,689
There is also something we seem to be forgetting. The runaway pollution problem in China. Even if it was for the sake of industrialisation I know most of us wouldn't trade the clean air and the clean soils and water that we have.that's what the west chose and drove the filth to China. it's only that in China the media is gagged and there is no democracy. Otherwise if they could open the doors to their health facilities you would pray that we remain poor but heathy for ever.
I hope they could share their statistics on cancer and other pollution related ailments to the outside world.
Politics is just things to keep the people divided and foolish and put your trust in men and none of them can do nothing for you...
harrydre
#56 Posted : Tuesday, May 21, 2019 2:36:07 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/10/2008
Posts: 9,026
Location: Kanjo
2012 wrote:
Angelica _ann wrote:
This is a bluff, Trump thinks China will be bullied into submission, no!!!


This war is affecting the US more than China. Here are a few facts:

US is the largest exporter of Soy to China.

Chinese affordable products make up the biggest inventory in US supermarkets.

Chinese manufacture for majority of American companies with their cheap labour due to high technical government training. Just try watching Shark Tank.

Huawei is the largest technology company in the world and most of their technology is supplied to them by Silicon Valley, American firms. Huawei is also the second largest smart phone manufacturer with over 30 million phones sold this year so far and they all run on America's, Google owned Android system.

Other Chinese phone manufacturers eg Tecno, Oppo, Infinix, Xiaomi etc all use Android system outside China.

China is Apple biggest foreign consumer and and can't afford to lose it....



Nobody wins in a trade war. Today Trump pulled back on steel and aluminum tariffs after Mexico and Canada reteriated with agricultural tariffs. Trump farmers got hurt big time, started commiting suicides.

China has advantage as it's not a democracy. Try that shit with American farmer and he will be out of office 2020.

murchr
#57 Posted : Tuesday, May 21, 2019 4:04:27 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 2/26/2012
Posts: 14,481
U.S. eases some restrictions on China's Huawei to keep networks operating
"There are only two emotions in the market, hope & fear. The problem is you hope when you should fear & fear when you should hope: - Jesse Livermore
.
harrydre
#58 Posted : Tuesday, May 21, 2019 6:29:54 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/10/2008
Posts: 9,026
Location: Kanjo
2012
#59 Posted : Tuesday, May 21, 2019 11:18:08 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/9/2009
Posts: 6,357
Location: Nairobi
There should be a global law or standard that should prevent companies with global presence from being under control of a nation to protect the customer. Huawei should sue Google if they pull the plug on Android from their customers.

But I'm sure Google will pay Huawei billions for contract infringement.

But I do not understand these spying claims. If the US or China were to spy on Kenya, who would be the most effective?
Huawei has the hardware while US has the software including almost all our emails, call logs via Android and Apple OS, FB, Twitter, Cisco...

Stand for something or you will fall for anything. Today's mighty oak is yesterday's nut that held its ground. Rosa Parks
AlphDoti
#60 Posted : Tuesday, May 21, 2019 11:37:52 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/20/2008
Posts: 5,925
Location: Kenya
2012 wrote:
There should be a global law or standard that should prevent companies with global presence from being under control of a nation to protect the customer. Huawei should sue Google if they pull the plug on Android from their customers.

But I'm sure Google will pay Huawei billions for contract infringement.

But I do not understand these spying claims. If the US or China were to spy on Kenya, who would be the most effective?
Huawei has the hardware while US has the software including almost all our emails, call logs via Android and Apple OS, FB, Twitter, Cisco...

My thinking exactly. Are they not spying on Windows we are all using on our computers, including in China itself? Are they not spying using all these software coming from US? Why make such claims on someone else... This is just bullying. Consumers need to rise against the bully!
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