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Centum 2019/2020
Ericsson
#1 Posted : Monday, August 19, 2019 9:13:43 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 7,227
Location: NAIROBI
Centum is pleased to announce the completion of sale of our 100% stake in King Beverage Limited to Danish Brewing Company E.A Limited, a subsidiary of Bounty Global Management DWC LLC

https://pbs.twimg.com/me...rmat=jpg&name=medium
VituVingiSana
#2 Posted : Monday, August 19, 2019 9:25:13 AM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 16,288
Location: Nairobi
Ericsson wrote:
Centum is pleased to announce the completion of sale of our 100% stake in King Beverage Limited to Danish Brewing Company E.A Limited, a subsidiary of Bounty Global Management DWC LLC

https://pbs.twimg.com/me...mat=jpg&name=medium
Applause Applause Applause
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7hx4gdlfamo
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
littledove
#3 Posted : Monday, August 19, 2019 10:19:19 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 7/1/2014
Posts: 722
Location: sky
[quote=Ericsson]Centum is pleased to announce the completion of sale of our 100% stake in King Beverage Limited to Danish Brewing Company E.A Limited, a subsidiary of Bounty Global Management DWC LLC

https://pbs.twimg.com/me...mat=jpg&name=medium[/quote]
any figures and with comparison with valuation?
There are only two emotions in the stock market, fear and hope. The problem is, you hope when you should fear and fear when you should hope
Ericsson
#4 Posted : Monday, August 19, 2019 10:29:15 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 7,227
Location: NAIROBI
littledove wrote:
[quote=Ericsson]Centum is pleased to announce the completion of sale of our 100% stake in King Beverage Limited to Danish Brewing Company E.A Limited, a subsidiary of Bounty Global Management DWC LLC

https://pbs.twimg.com/me...mat=jpg&name=medium[/quote]
any figures and with comparison with valuation?

They made a loss of ksh.370mn at disposal.
They invested sh.500mn and sold at ksh.130mn
Horton
#5 Posted : Monday, August 19, 2019 10:51:01 PM
Rank: Veteran


Joined: 8/30/2007
Posts: 1,448
Location: Nairobi
Ericsson wrote:
littledove wrote:
[quote=Ericsson]Centum is pleased to announce the completion of sale of our 100% stake in King Beverage Limited to Danish Brewing Company E.A Limited, a subsidiary of Bounty Global Management DWC LLC

https://pbs.twimg.com/me...mat=jpg&name=medium[/quote]
any figures and with comparison with valuation?

They made a loss of ksh.370mn at disposal.
They invested sh.500mn and sold at ksh.130mn



Asset fire sale?
Angelica _ann
#6 Posted : Monday, August 19, 2019 11:00:38 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/7/2012
Posts: 10,791
Horton wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
littledove wrote:
[quote=Ericsson]Centum is pleased to announce the completion of sale of our 100% stake in King Beverage Limited to Danish Brewing Company E.A Limited, a subsidiary of Bounty Global Management DWC LLC

https://pbs.twimg.com/me...mat=jpg&name=medium[/quote]
any figures and with comparison with valuation?

They made a loss of ksh.370mn at disposal.
They invested sh.500mn and sold at ksh.130mn



Asset fire sale?



https://www.businessdail...asAMP-s58jiiz/index.html
In the business world, everyone is paid in two coins - cash and experience. Take the experience first; the cash will come later - H Geneen
VituVingiSana
#7 Posted : Monday, August 19, 2019 11:01:03 PM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 16,288
Location: Nairobi
Ericsson wrote:
littledove wrote:
[quote=Ericsson]Centum is pleased to announce the completion of sale of our 100% stake in King Beverage Limited to Danish Brewing Company E.A Limited, a subsidiary of Bounty Global Management DWC LLC

https://pbs.twimg.com/me...mat=jpg&name=medium[/quote]
any figures and with comparison with valuation?

They made a loss of ksh.370mn at disposal.
They invested sh.500mn and sold at ksh.130mn
Not what one wants to hear but one can't win them all.
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
Angelica _ann
#8 Posted : Monday, August 19, 2019 11:31:29 PM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/7/2012
Posts: 10,791
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
littledove wrote:
[quote=Ericsson]Centum is pleased to announce the completion of sale of our 100% stake in King Beverage Limited to Danish Brewing Company E.A Limited, a subsidiary of Bounty Global Management DWC LLC

https://pbs.twimg.com/me...mat=jpg&name=medium[/quote]
any figures and with comparison with valuation?

They made a loss of ksh.370mn at disposal.
They invested sh.500mn and sold at ksh.130mn
Not what one wants to hear but one can't win them all.


Obiero amelala smile
In the business world, everyone is paid in two coins - cash and experience. Take the experience first; the cash will come later - H Geneen
Kusadikika
#9 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 2:53:08 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 7/22/2008
Posts: 2,570
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??
littledove
#10 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 8:29:38 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 7/1/2014
Posts: 722
Location: sky
Kusadikika wrote:
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??



The problem is they are now almost left with real estate which is also struggling - hfck, what next?
There are only two emotions in the stock market, fear and hope. The problem is, you hope when you should fear and fear when you should hope
sparkly
#11 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 8:52:50 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 9/23/2009
Posts: 7,210
Location: Enk are Nyirobi
Kusadikika wrote:
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??


Reinvesting in real estate and leasing business
Life is short. Live passionately.
Ericsson
#12 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 9:10:15 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 7,227
Location: NAIROBI
littledove wrote:
Kusadikika wrote:
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??



The problem is they are now almost left with real estate which is also struggling - hfck, what next?


Time will tell
VituVingiSana
#13 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 9:11:20 AM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 16,288
Location: Nairobi
sparkly wrote:
Kusadikika wrote:
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??

Reinvesting in real estate and leasing business
The pessimism is good for buyers Applause
Buffett writes that earnings gyrations “don’t bother us in the least.” After all, “Charlie (Munger) and I would much rather earn a lumpy 15 percent over time than a smooth 12 percent.”
This is not a case of losses year after year after year. It's a loss in a project. Happens.

The concentration of the portfolio in Real Estate may be problematic but is also an opportunity. Centum has huge holdings that can produce income, through phased sales, over time.

In the meantime, I hope this news creates a buying opportunity! Laughing out loudly
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
obiero
#14 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 9:18:49 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 12,179
Location: nairobi
VituVingiSana wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Kusadikika wrote:
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??

Reinvesting in real estate and leasing business
The pessimism is good for buyers Applause
Buffett writes that earnings gyrations “don’t bother us in the least.” After all, “Charlie (Munger) and I would much rather earn a lumpy 15 percent over time than a smooth 12 percent.”
This is not a case of losses year after year after year. It's a loss in a project. Happens.

The concentration of the portfolio in Real Estate may be problematic but is also an opportunity. Centum has huge holdings that can produce income, through phased sales, over time.

In the meantime, I hope this news creates a buying opportunity! Laughing out loudly

Real estate in Kenya is crumbling my brother. Unless the economic situation changes, time will get hard for firms like Centum. Atleast they have realized alcoholic beverages, ABL and Sidian Bank were not the best placement of capital
COOP 5,500; KCB 7,500; KNRE 100,000; KQ 221,100
VituVingiSana
#15 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 9:26:31 AM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 16,288
Location: Nairobi
obiero wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Kusadikika wrote:
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??

Reinvesting in real estate and leasing business
The pessimism is good for buyers Applause
Buffett writes that earnings gyrations “don’t bother us in the least.” After all, “Charlie (Munger) and I would much rather earn a lumpy 15 percent over time than a smooth 12 percent.”
This is not a case of losses year after year after year. It's a loss in a project. Happens.

The concentration of the portfolio in Real Estate may be problematic but is also an opportunity. Centum has huge holdings that can produce income, through phased sales, over time.

In the meantime, I hope this news creates a buying opportunity! Laughing out loudly

Real estate in Kenya is crumbling my brother. Unless the economic situation changes, time will get hard for firms like Centum. Atleast they have realized alcoholic beverages, ABL and Sidian Bank were not the best placement of capital
Real Estate is in bad shape but after seeing the types of houses/buildings and prices on HF's website I am not surprised.
Ugly. Expensive.

If Centum can provide quality at fair prices then Kenyans will flock back into real estate. For now, I think Centum should take baby steps in new real estate projects. Phased approach.

At the same time, I do not want Centum to be afraid of making bold moves that seem sensible. Paying off the bond/s is a good move to reduce annual cash outflow by reducing interest costs.
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
Ericsson
#16 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 9:31:27 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 7,227
Location: NAIROBI
VituVingiSana wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Kusadikika wrote:
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??

Reinvesting in real estate and leasing business
The pessimism is good for buyers Applause
Buffett writes that earnings gyrations “don’t bother us in the least.” After all, “Charlie (Munger) and I would much rather earn a lumpy 15 percent over time than a smooth 12 percent.”
This is not a case of losses year after year after year. It's a loss in a project. Happens.

The concentration of the portfolio in Real Estate may be problematic but is also an opportunity. Centum has huge holdings that can produce income, through phased sales, over time.

In the meantime, I hope this news creates a buying opportunity! Laughing out loudly


What new thing/approach is centum doing/taking that the others who are suffering in real estate haven't done.
Ericsson
#17 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 9:33:53 AM
Rank: Elder


Joined: 12/4/2009
Posts: 7,227
Location: NAIROBI
VituVingiSana wrote:
obiero wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Kusadikika wrote:
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??

Reinvesting in real estate and leasing business
The pessimism is good for buyers Applause
Buffett writes that earnings gyrations “don’t bother us in the least.” After all, “Charlie (Munger) and I would much rather earn a lumpy 15 percent over time than a smooth 12 percent.”
This is not a case of losses year after year after year. It's a loss in a project. Happens.

The concentration of the portfolio in Real Estate may be problematic but is also an opportunity. Centum has huge holdings that can produce income, through phased sales, over time.

In the meantime, I hope this news creates a buying opportunity! Laughing out loudly

Real estate in Kenya is crumbling my brother. Unless the economic situation changes, time will get hard for firms like Centum. Atleast they have realized alcoholic beverages, ABL and Sidian Bank were not the best placement of capital
Real Estate is in bad shape but after seeing the types of houses/buildings and prices on HF's website I am not surprised.
Ugly. Expensive.

If Centum can provide quality at fair prices then Kenyans will flock back into real estate. For now, I think Centum should take baby steps in new real estate projects. Phased approach.

At the same time, I do not want Centum to be afraid of making bold moves that seem sensible. Paying off the bond/s is a good move to reduce annual cash outflow by reducing interest costs.


Paying off the bond and they took another ksh.7.4bn loan from Nedbank
VituVingiSana
#18 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 10:10:49 AM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 16,288
Location: Nairobi
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Kusadikika wrote:
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??

Reinvesting in real estate and leasing business
The pessimism is good for buyers Applause
Buffett writes that earnings gyrations “don’t bother us in the least.” After all, “Charlie (Munger) and I would much rather earn a lumpy 15 percent over time than a smooth 12 percent.”
This is not a case of losses year after year after year. It's a loss in a project. Happens.

The concentration of the portfolio in Real Estate may be problematic but is also an opportunity. Centum has huge holdings that can produce income, through phased sales, over time.

In the meantime, I hope this news creates a buying opportunity! Laughing out loudly


What new thing/approach is centum doing/taking that the others who are suffering in real estate haven't done.
IMHO, the quality and planning of their residential developments is better than many others I have seen. The pricing isn't what one would call affordable. They need to work on affordability to increase uptake. Of course, there's also a question of segmentation i.e. some people want to live in Runda regardless of "value for money" due to perception, etc.
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
VituVingiSana
#19 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 10:20:04 AM
Rank: Chief


Joined: 1/3/2007
Posts: 16,288
Location: Nairobi
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
obiero wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Kusadikika wrote:
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??

Reinvesting in real estate and leasing business
The pessimism is good for buyers Applause
Buffett writes that earnings gyrations “don’t bother us in the least.” After all, “Charlie (Munger) and I would much rather earn a lumpy 15 percent over time than a smooth 12 percent.”
This is not a case of losses year after year after year. It's a loss in a project. Happens.

The concentration of the portfolio in Real Estate may be problematic but is also an opportunity. Centum has huge holdings that can produce income, through phased sales, over time.

In the meantime, I hope this news creates a buying opportunity! Laughing out loudly

Real estate in Kenya is crumbling my brother. Unless the economic situation changes, time will get hard for firms like Centum. Atleast they have realized alcoholic beverages, ABL and Sidian Bank were not the best placement of capital
Real Estate is in bad shape but after seeing the types of houses/buildings and prices on HF's website I am not surprised.
Ugly. Expensive.

If Centum can provide quality at fair prices then Kenyans will flock back into real estate. For now, I think Centum should take baby steps in new real estate projects. Phased approach.

At the same time, I do not want Centum to be afraid of making bold moves that seem sensible. Paying off the bond/s is a good move to reduce annual cash outflow by reducing interest costs.


Paying off the bond and they took another ksh.7.4bn loan from Nedbank
Was this recent? I went through the latest Investor Presentation and Financial Report and I think Centum is looking to pay down most of the loans (excluding ODs and some small stuff) at the Holding level including the bond and Nedbank loan by 2021.
Have I made an error or misinterpreted this?
Greedy when others are fearful. Very fearful when others are greedy - to paraphrase Warren Buffett
nairobby
#20 Posted : Tuesday, August 20, 2019 10:32:14 AM
Rank: Member


Joined: 1/18/2019
Posts: 139
Location: kenya
VituVingiSana wrote:
Ericsson wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
obiero wrote:
VituVingiSana wrote:
sparkly wrote:
Kusadikika wrote:
What is going on???!!!!

Building a war chest to buy something big?? or Seeing danger ahead and wanting to hold onto cash for now??

What would you make of it if you heard Centum is just buying dollars??

Reinvesting in real estate and leasing business
The pessimism is good for buyers Applause
Buffett writes that earnings gyrations “don’t bother us in the least.” After all, “Charlie (Munger) and I would much rather earn a lumpy 15 percent over time than a smooth 12 percent.”
This is not a case of losses year after year after year. It's a loss in a project. Happens.

The concentration of the portfolio in Real Estate may be problematic but is also an opportunity. Centum has huge holdings that can produce income, through phased sales, over time.

In the meantime, I hope this news creates a buying opportunity! Laughing out loudly

Real estate in Kenya is crumbling my brother. Unless the economic situation changes, time will get hard for firms like Centum. Atleast they have realized alcoholic beverages, ABL and Sidian Bank were not the best placement of capital
Real Estate is in bad shape but after seeing the types of houses/buildings and prices on HF's website I am not surprised.
Ugly. Expensive.

If Centum can provide quality at fair prices then Kenyans will flock back into real estate. For now, I think Centum should take baby steps in new real estate projects. Phased approach.

At the same time, I do not want Centum to be afraid of making bold moves that seem sensible. Paying off the bond/s is a good move to reduce annual cash outflow by reducing interest costs.


Paying off the bond and they took another ksh.7.4bn loan from Nedbank
Was this recent? I went through the latest Investor Presentation and Financial Report and I think Centum is looking to pay down most of the loans (excluding ODs and some small stuff) at the Holding level including the bond and Nedbank loan by 2021.
Have I made an error or misinterpreted this?


The 7.4b Nedbank loan is recent and I think its the one funding Cascadia & Riverbank.
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